Quote: Geoff Empey

To me the only way to do that is to wrestle the rights of breed registration from clubs based around the Conformation crowd like the AKC and CKC. As those bodies did not do the GSD and other working breeds any favours the past 60 years in North America.

The Working Sporting Malinois needs an organization like the http://www.americanbordercollie.org/ to protect the Working Malinois from the conformation disease that runs amok on this continent ..

Just say 'NO' to Barbie and Ken Malinois!!

As someone who personally feel that breeders, and not the AKC, is accountable for poor breeding choices, I will leave the AKC comments alone ;-) However, I just wanted to point out that the Malinois has the American Working Malinois Association: http://www.workingmalinois.com - I encourage people who are interested in the working malinois to join the organization and help to work towards keeping working in the breed.

I have been poking through the working malinois site. It seems like it is more a IPO site for Malinios than a total specific protection of the working in Working Malinois. Are they the only game in town? I was more hoping along something like the working border collie association. You know something that will bring together all the working venues and protection type of sports to promote the Malinois in those functions.

There are also plenty of "experienced" folks that simply shouldn't own a Mal and people that have owned 10 dogs and still don't get it. Even worse, there are people that think they belong in the "learn faster and get it" category and really do not.

Poster: Mike J Schoonbrood
Subject: Re: Malinois - Not for Beginners?

I'm not posting to get into a pissing match with you, I am posting to try and get this retarded notion out of peoples heads that Mal's are appropriate beginner dogs. There are always exceptions, and always those that learn faster and "get it." There are also plenty of "experienced" folks that simply shouldn't own a Mal and people that have owned 10 dogs and still don't get it. Even worse, there are people that think they belong in the "learn faster and get it" category and really do not.

The general rule of thumb is that everybody ****s up their first 3 dogs to some degree, and from then on out they get more right and less wrong as time goes on. ****ing up with a Malinois can totally trash any potential the dog had, or get the handler into a whole world of trouble.

Look at the number of beginners that post here that ask the worlds most basic questions and are essentially "learning on the job." No matter how much preparation a person goes through to try and prepare themselves for their first working dog, a Malinois no less, you cannot learn without doing, and a Malinois is not the ideal dog to learn on the job with from scratch. Not to mention all the pack structure issues that beginners have with their dogs and need help with. A male Mal with any kind of dominant tendencies will wipe the floor with someone that hesitates and doesn't know how to deal with the dog.

Can it be done? Obviously it can by the right person with the right dog. I never said it CAN'T be done. This forum is read by thousands of people, it is better to address the vast majority than the tiny minority.

The downside to the internet is also that people can really say anything they want about their dogs and nobody can disprove it. I have met people that brag about their dogs endlessly 20 minutes before I actually see the dogs work, and the dogs sucked really really badly. You'd think the handlers would be embarrassed about all their bragging, but no, they honestly believe their dogs are that great. Thats without the internet to hide behind.

There are so many Mals out there, that there will inevitably be people that think they have the worlds greatest dog and go around telling everyone how nice and easy the dogs are to train. I'm not addressing you at all Geoff, just making a general statement. I will never be the one to announce on a forum that everyone that wants a Mal can train one because they are easy to train. That's pretty ridiculous right there.