Julie,

thanks for the idea....self control is something we are working on. we play "hide n seek" in the house and it used to be i would have him lay down and i would only walk a room away but could keep an i on him and it was several times before he finally stayed in one place.... now we are up to i can lay him down, stay, and then walk upstairs and into my bedroom to plant treats and he will (95% of the time) stay in the same place...if he moves though i tell him to go back to the carpet and lay down and he will eventually do this...then i release him.

yesterday when i came back after the gym, i played ball on my terms with him for 5 mins and then put the flat collar (not the prong) on him and took him to the park again. he did pull a bit again but i could eventually get him to my side and quiet enough to walk where we set up to play... he did fine though the tennis court lights i use as lighting went out after 10 mins so we didn't get to do much but it was a start...

most of this problem stems from self control i feel...

last night we played some games where i had a towel in the room and first he just had to go and touch it and i would click for a treat... (no verbal commands just staring at him so he would figure it out) and then moved the towel and this time he had to sit... then on to lay down.... its funny to watch his brain work and then give those small barks (where he raises his snout in the air) and looks at you as if to ask "what the hell do you want from me?????" eventually he starts trying things to get it...

we are currently working on the "bow" trick ..this one is tougher as he always wants to lay down but its starting to come along.... roll over took all of 5 min's to teach a couple days ago...

i will continue to work on his self control though and hopefully this will all come together...

thanks again,

john

 Quote: john vanecko

yesterday when i came back after the gym, i played ball on my terms with him for 5 mins and then put the flat collar (not the prong) on him and took him to the park again. he did pull a bit again but i could eventually get him to my side and quiet enough to walk where we set up to play... he did fine though the tennis court lights i use as lighting went out after 10 mins so we didn't get to do much but it was a start...

Ok, so now that you know that tiring him out a bit BEFORE you head out on walks works, try to play ball with him for more than just 5 minutes before you head out. I had to play ball for at least 15 minutes to tire my dog out before our walks.
I think that the dog is just too amped up at the beginning when you head out that he has to work off some steam before you put him in the whole "park" situation.

 Quote: john vanecko

we are currently working on the "bow" trick ..this one is tougher as he always wants to lay down but its starting to come along.... roll over took all of 5 min's to teach a couple days ago...
john

Now, I have absolutely nothing against teaching a dog tricks...it's a great thing to wear them out mentally.
But maybe you should, for now, concentrate on working more on his obedience than teaching tricks.
Now don't everyone jump on me, i've taught my dog quite a few tricks...but i did the tricks thing after he had most of his obedience down.
I think helping the dog improve on his obedience work first would help out more than teaching tricks', for now. The hide & seek is fine (IMO) as you are incorporating obedience into it (down, stay)

 Quote: john vanecko

...i will continue to work on his self control though and hopefully this will all come together...

Have I got a book for you!

Control Unleashed by Leslie McDevitt. It's full of exercises to help you create a focused and confident dog. Impulse control is critical, especially with high drive dogs.

I love tricks. They are good for many reasons...lots of them provide streching and limbering of various body parts (the bow is a good example); they are a fun thing to work on with your dog, which is great for establishing a sound training relationship; it's fun to show them off...I could go on. Also, when you are working on obedience commands and such, you can always mix in trick commands, like when you're playing fetch and asking for behaviors before the ball reward; why not ask for a trick one time, a sit or down or heel another? It's all about having fun with your dog, regardless of what you're working on.

leih

 Quote: john vanecko

however when we play frisbee or soccer, he gets the toy brings it back and won't let go until he is absolutely ready.

when we play if i say "out" or "drop" calmly, he doesn't really respond,

when he's biting the leash there isn't a command he listens to at all....drop out down sit nothing...

he has taken to not paying attention to jumping etc and as soon as he is off leash he loves to chase the other dogs that are in the other ring running up and down the fence barking at them and not coming back to us....

speaking of heel and walking etc, when we are on a walk and we have him in "heel" he tends to keep inching his way forward...

as for basic obedience we practice sit, stay, down, stand, back, etc in the house all the time and even with hand signals for sit stand and down... we definitely need to practice the heel n come/recall a ton more...

but i can not trust him off leash right now... he has 0 recall

Ok, so is it just me or does it sound like this dog has ALOT on it's plate right now that you are trying to deal with.

I think this may be the cause of some of the issue's you are having with him.

Are you sure that the dog know's a command before you move onto the next one?

It seems like he might be getting too much information at once, and hasn't had the time to learn one thing and whats expected of him before you move onto the next.

You list alot of issues, but to be fair (to yourself and Chewy) you can't tackle all of them at once.

I think, for right now you should work on the one's that concern you the most. Im not saying work on single issues and let him get away with everything until you have that down pat, but from your posts it sounds like he's got alot of things coming at him at once and that may be part of the problem

Not saying he's not a smart enough guy to tackle multiple things, but to be fair, maybe put some things on the back burner for now??? Just until you get other things in order.

Are you sure that the dog know's a command before you move onto the next one?

I guess my question is how do i know if a dog really "knows" a command? With sit, i can say "sit" and he sits quickly.
with down, he lays on his belly. i can use the hand signal for lay down and he drops to his belly. i can say come front and he comes straight at me and sits infront of me. with "heel" he runs and turns his butt to my left side and sits down. if he is laying down and gets up and moves forward before i say, i can say "back" and he scoots back and back and back until i tell him "down" and he will then lay down again and i tell him stay and he stays in place until i release (though pending on his excited state this can be 30 sec or several minutes)...

just yesterday at the park i had him all excited and i would have him down and stay as i started walking away from him (back turned) and then walked to nearly the end of my line (about 80') and would wait a moment before i said ok and he would race to and passed me as i threw the frisbee. he stays in place (usually lifting his butt in the air anticipating a release) until i release though sometimes he moves forward and from 80' away i just had to say "back" and he would move back away from me and then down make him wait 30 sec or longer then throw....

with these things in mind, i feel chewy knows each and every one of the commands but i may be totally wrong????


I think, for right now you should work on the one's that concern you the most. Im not saying work on single issues and let him get away with everything until you have that down pat, but from your posts it sounds like he's got alot of things coming at him at once and that may be part of the problem

the last couple days i have tried to play some ball or something in the house before going to the park and then i take a few treats and keep his mind focused on me in a heel as we walk into the park so he isn't going bonkers... i also removed the prong and went to the flat collar which seems to keep him from getting pissed off..... he has managed to make it out to the middle of the park now and he knows the routine at that point: he lays down while i rack the rope (climbing term for taking the 100' line and running unraveling it to make sure it doesn't get knotted up when we run) and then i clip to his harness, undo the leash from his collar, and then move away from him while he stays until i throw the first ball etc....the last few days he has been great. decided to hold off on the running until i get his full attention and don't need food to keep it while we walk from the car.

John