Reg: 01-23-2006
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Loc: Cali & Wash State
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Quote: matthew grubb
I have been both blessed and cursed with one of those rare ultra dominant, handler aggressive dogs. If it wouldn’t be totally unfair to my dog, I’d take him outside and trigger an aggressive response so it could be video taped for viewing.
Unless you have one of these dogs or have truly “seen it all” you will never truly understand what types of dogs are being discussed. You can’t train this out of the dog… if it were possible to do, you are talking about triggering the absolute worse response in the world in an animal and then attempting to correct it with leash corrections that most likely triggered the response in the first place.
You have to deal with it when it happens and make the event so memorable for the dog that he truly believes that he was struck down by the hand of God (yours) and is lucky to be alive.
I did a hotel drug search with my dog once where he alerted inside a purse. I tossed the purse to another officer and asked him to search it. As soon as the officer stuck his hand inside the purse my dog got aggressive towards the officer… my belief was that my dog thought the officer was going to take his drug reward toy from out of the purse (dog thinks its in there).
The unwarranted aggression earned about three level 8.5 leash corrections from me. At this point he started growling at me. This aggression towards me got the whole level 10 correction! This triggered a fight of flight response with a dog that has no flight. He clamped down on my hand and wasn’t letting go.
We had it out in the hotel room…. And I will tell you that Ed’s suggestion on dealing with this works. I have not had a repeat since. I do understand what triggers it and how to avoid it.
Sometimes being “the Alpha” just doesn’t get the job done, especially if you own one of “those dogs”.
Spoken like only one who has truly "been there, done that"!!!
On that note, I think I will retire from this thread, I think it can't be explained any better or any further.
Connie Sutherland Moderator Reg: 07-13-2005
Posts: 31571
Loc: North-Central coast of California
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Quote: susan tuck
... Spoken like only one who has truly "been there, done that"!!!
On that note, I think I will retire from this thread, I think it can't be explained any better or any further.
You're right. It isn't ignorance or pet v. working, either; it's simply that until you see the situation where it's needed, it's VERY difficult to picture it.
It was impossible for me, until I met my first of what CM calls a "red-zone" dog.
Matthew Grubb Webboard User Reg: 09-27-2002
Posts: 637
Loc: Pittsburgh, Pa.
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Quote: Benjamin Colbert
What I find inappropriate would be if you were to call your fellow officer to meet you and then reenact the situation in order to give you a chance to correct the dog again. This is the training situation I'm speaking about.
Ben… I hear what you are saying. In my example I was lucky, when it happened I was able to deal with it right there on the spot.
The issue comes when you can’t, or are unable to deal with it at the time of the incident. If he would have bit me and I spent the next 2 minutes bandaging my hand we would have lost the opportunity to correct the issue and would have no other option other to at some point trigger it again in a training situation and address it.
If a dominant house pet left unchecked can cause you a world of grief, an uber dominant working dog left unchecked can ruine your life and ultimately end his.
"What I find inappropriate would be if you were to call your fellow officer to meet you and then reenact the situation in order to give you a chance to correct the dog again. This is the training situation I'm speaking about."
Benjamin,
My trainer calls it "ambush" training. When the dog is old enough to know what you're asking and you're in the correcting stage or proofing stage of training why not set up the dog? I do it all the time. Keeps the surprizes at a minimum. If you avoid situations you can't train for it. I also think a lot of people think they have dominant dogs when in reality they're just crappy leaders who don't know it. Most dogs are born followers.
Borrow Matts dog and try the alternative method and make a decision after that, LOL.
To the original question,
I have a super soft dog that when he needs a collar i use a choke chain so i have something to hook the leash to, no corrections needed his ob is awesome and hasn't worn a collar in years, That's about all the good chokers are for, lol
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Re: Choke Chains
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his ob is awesome and hasn't worn a collar in years, That's about all the good chokers are for, lol
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