Mike
You make some very good points about working dogs, which I would agree with.

Most people who want companions/pets do not want biters and dominant dogs, and don't know how to handle them if they get one.

 Quote: mike j schoonbrood

Thoughts? Misconceptions?

Hi Mike,

I'll give it a go. First, I am going back to a previous post about the fear period and confidence of the dog. The first fear period occurs between 8-11 weeks. I think this confuses a lot of people because they think "fear period" my puppy will act afraid. This is not the case. It is actually the period in a pup's development when a traumatic incident is most likely to imprint and stay with the dog forever. Fears that start at this age are very difficult to untrain and overcome. All puppies go through this phase no matter what their temperment, it is life's lessons in survival.

In my opinion, the confidence level of the handler is what can make or break the pup during this phase which is why I prefer to have the puppy with me.

Example: My daughter who was 10 years old was vacuuming, while I showered, and my 10 week old pup was gated in the laundry room. He either climbed or jumped the gate, ran to the vacuum cleaner, my daughter didn't see him and ran him over. He yelped and she coddled him and made a big deal about it because she felt terrible. To this day my dog, leaves the room, pants and drools whenever I vacuum.

During this same time I had him on a long line and was walking him with a friend and her lab. The lab jumped into a lake, my puppy followed, was over his head, had never swum before, and looked panic stricken, I had him on a line and was only 10 feet away so I was not nervous about him drowning, I encouraged him to come to me; the doggy paddle kicked in and no ill effects; as a matter of fact he LOVES swimming. If I behaved differently it could have gone the other way.

With that said, a good breeder will know his/her lines and can make an educated decision on when the optimal time is for the puppy to go to its new home. I'd say the majority of puppies are good to go between the 7-9 week range.

As far as pack etiquette, I think it is valuable for all dogs. Bite inhibition is a bit strong of an explanation on what the pup learns from its litter mates. As anyone who has brought home the little alligators at 8 weeks can attest to with scratched ankles and punctured hands . Think of it more as a controlled bite vs. the desire not to bite. I think a controlled bite would be a huge asset to bitework, though I have never worked a dog in bitework so could be completely off base.

I am in complete agreement with puppies romping together unsupervised. Puppies practice domination/submission within the litter, this is good. However; and again an educated breeder is your best friend can tell when this has changed from role playing to "real" world and will seperate the puppies. I am with you 100% my puppy should not be dominated or lose confidence from being left too long with its pack.

I will PM a great article about the developmental stages of the pup when I can find it. I think you would enjoy it.

 Quote: sheila buckley

I'll give it a go. First, I am going back to a previous post about the fear period and confidence of the dog. The first fear period occurs between 8-11 weeks. I think this confuses a lot of people because they think "fear period" my puppy will act afraid. This is not the case. It is actually the period in a pup's development when a traumatic incident is most likely to imprint and stay with the dog forever. Fears that start at this age are very difficult to untrain and overcome. All puppies go through this phase no matter what their temperment, it is life's lessons in survival.

In my opinion, the confidence level of the handler is what can make or break the pup during this phase which is why I prefer to have the puppy with me.

Sheila, thanks for that great explanation and the examples you provided. I had been wondering the same thing, since my pup never 'acted' fearful during this stage.

I'm sorry, I still don't buy the fear period stuff. The stuff I've read on it suggests that it also happens at much older ages. I just can't believe that if my dog experiences something at 11 months that it won't faze him, but if he experiences the same thing at 15 months old (since theres supposed to be a fear period between 14 and 18 months old right?) that it will scar him for life!?

If it'll affect the dog at 15 months old, it'll affect him at 10 months, 8 months, 6 months, 4 months, 2 months, etc. Either the dog can deal with something or he can't. The younger he is the less capable of dealing with it, I'll buy that, something may be traumatic at 8 weeks old that they would ignore at 8 months old, but this whole concept of there being specific time frames of a dog being more succeptible is just odd to me, especialy to generalize it to a specific timeframe for all dogs. Hormones can do goofy things to a dog, but I refuse to believe that a dog that is genetically sound will be anything but while growing up. Either the dog is nervey or he's not.

I'd like my pup at 7-8 weeks at the latest. Keep it with you all the time, even on a long lead when weeding in the garden or whatever, and you'll have a good companion for work or otherwise.

It depends on the breeder for others - if he is a good breeder, you could take the pup later. But if he just "lets the pups be" without adding any impulse, then he's obviously better with you.

At 6-7 weeks, the pups don't experience fear. You might think it's a pretty cool pup and overtax it. Here you need to be careful.

Another thing is, most 7-8 week old pups are "home boys", i.e. they don't automatically want to explore the great wide world like you do. A garden, with interesting things to do (with you) in it is enough.

As for "fear" at 15 months - what I noticed was hormonal stress, making my "nice little lads" turn into bullies, no more no less.

Gillian