David C.Frost Webboard User Reg: 01-23-2002
Posts: 1204
Loc: Nashville, TN
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USPCA is voting in September to see if they want to include the ORT/NORT test as part of their certification. I'm just curious as to what other EDD handler/trainers feel about this. I'm not bashful; I'm opposed to this step. To me, it's a step backwards. I also feel the EDD community is being caught in an ego battle between federal agencies. At any rate, I was wondering what others might think. USPCA's proposal is on their website.
DFrost
Any behavior that is reinforced is more likely to occur again.
Hummm,
I can imagine a test which begins with recognition and ends with a test of searching proficiency that would be beneficial. But, my thoughts are that there is no way it will get done in a manner which does what I think a EDD test should cover:
Test ability to differentiate and identify odors, test to determine if a EDD is able to search under distractions, test to see that a dog can maintain focus on the task for a reasonable length of time.
Now, put a dozen dog folks in one room and try, just try to come up with this off the cuff. Then add a federal agencies long standing attempt to place some type of overarching control on the community and wha-la you have crap.
No one in the US, and I mean no one, has ever done a task analysis and critical skills evaluation on the EDD teams to determine what they should know let alone manged to conclusively determine what the average competent team does to get there and maintain it and what measures could show that in a nutshell.
David C.Frost Webboard User Reg: 01-23-2002
Posts: 1204
Loc: Nashville, TN
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Ha ha, darn Kevin, hate to put you in a position where you agree with me. Actually, the military did do a task anaylis, it's better than most I've seen. You are correct though, there is a lot of work that could be done. I've said before, I don't have a problem with a standardized certification, but going back to kindergarten isn't the way to do it. Like you, I want to see an operational test. I figure when TSA, DOD, Secret Service, FBI and Customs don't want any part of it's nothing more than a jockeying for position. They (ATF) want to be the big dog in that hunt. I've certainly expressed my views to USPCA. I also expressed my views to ATF during the developmental stage of the NORT. Thanks for your input though, I am curious how trainers feel about the whole process.
DFrost
Any behavior that is reinforced is more likely to occur again.
Howard Knauf Webboard User Reg: 09-24-2003
Posts: 1555
Loc: Melbourne, Florida
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Dog training is subjective enough as it is. What master trainer, or EDD guru is going to be the one to put it on paper as gospel. Also, as Kevin stated, What one person thinks is sufficient training or performance may not (and probably won't) be what another expects.
I foresee some outlandish, and impossible goals/standards when the thing is finally put to rest...if it ever is. Personally, I don't have a problem with the status quo. That includes the industry standard on hours of training (which I think should be more) and records and performance of proficiency.
Too many chiefs with their hands in the pie will only bastardize a noble position. Kevin, Terry Fleck and others who are the at the top of their game should be the ones who are consulted in what are real world practical standards for the EDD handler. JMO.
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ORT or NORT
#201740 - 07/14/2008 05:05 PM 
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