since it looks like the little midget is going to end up between 15-20lbs, i'm starting to look at gear for the winter for camping and hiking. i've already ordered luc (aka no body fat very poor cold tolerance) a combo coat from katahdin: http://www.katahdinms.com/product/b3ddabbc-1e8a-4599-b1d5-f1b798cdf905.aspx and enquired about custom sizing for neb.

but how cold intolerant are small dogs? i've read they have a harder time, but just how bad is it? especially if they're part husky (he does have a bare lower belly around his penis)?

it might be impossible to say, i'm just wondering if anyone has any experience with this, as i do continue to hike/snowshoe throughout the winter and would like to be able to take all the dogs out backpacking (teagan can definitely handle the cold; the only "winter" (november, -8C) trip i took the dogs on last year luc developed cold water tail despite wearing a shirt).

thanks

So... did you get the hot pink?

LOL! randy somewhere will be remembering luc and his quest to be manly

(i get constant 'she is so cute!' comments about him, followed by 'he'll really fill out when he's older'...he's 5 years old! he's just a small german shepherd that i accidentally exercised out of breed standard)

anyways, luc is getting a black combo coat. if they'll make one for mr. kenezzer, then i think we'll go w/the green to match his collar.

another small dog question - when he gets older (obvs. he's too young now) - i'd like neb to run w/luc and i. i built luc's stamina up for running, and i would do the same for neb. luc can run 25k+ no problem....are small dogs, as long as they're properly conditioned, also capable of this (and further), or should i be seeing neb as more of a short-run expert? he is part husky and part beagle, so even though he's a little midget , i'm thinking he should have some good running genes.

the one pic almost looks like hot pants...
I like that! Hot pink hot pants for dogs...

The answer is it depends how cold are we talking, for how long are you expecting to leave them out, in what kind of conditions as far as shelter or what activities?

I have a single coated toy breed between 4-8lbs at adulthood so for them the answer is very cold sensitive. During cold wet winter weather we treadmill. They are usually not left out for any length of time besides long enough to do their business below 40 degrees and after the first frost they have a dog house in their garage kennel with a heat pad in it.

Watch out for signs of hypothermia and frostbite on toes and tails.

well, hiking/snowshoeing, depending on the length of the hike, anywhere from 4-8 hrs/day. obviously he'll have to be built up to that. at the end of june he hiked from a snugli, with time here and there on the trail

backpacking, same amount of time moving, and then time in camp. day temperatures - say 4C to -30C worst case scenario, as a rule, probably 0C to -12C. he's fine being around fires, which would help (luc is not a fan of fires). nighttime in tent w/blankets and insulated pads.

he is part husky, so in that respect, should be able to handle cold, but he is also small, and i'm just not sure how much each factor will weigh. probably a matter of seeing how he does.

thanks for the tips re: hypothermia and frostbite. him being so small i will probably carry extra stuff for him for sleeping and in camp.

what is your experience with the distance smaller dogs can run? neb is bigger than your guys but still small. i don't want to limit him just b/c his legs are short, but i want to make sure it's reasonable i expect him to be able to do the same kind of distances a larger dog can do (i would expect a different exertion from him, b/c of his size, particularly if we were running on trail/uneven ground).

again... it depends. My papillons can run... miles at a fairly decent rate and keep going. Little legs can usually keep up with big legs. Husky/Beagle should be able to do that with no issues.

The main difference is that while my lab is happy to sleep in a mudpuddle while being snowed upon (I have pictures) next to a perfectly good dog house the paps look uncomfortable, act uncomfortable when cold. One morning when we lost power for nearly two weeks I woke up to my house being 25 degrees... my pillow was gone and I found it on the floor with a tail sticking out of it . My dog that has bed privledges decided to find a warm spot between the pillow cover and the pillow. Even then he was still very cold and I broke out the dreaded fleece doggie clothes to keep him warm.

Basically use people common sense. Keep him off the ground if you can while he sleeps. I find at least bringing a plastic/tarp sided blanket does this well and check his feet a few times a daywhen hiking for signs of ice build up between toes and frostbite. Check ears, toes, and tails for frostbite. If you see him shaking trying to stay warm while cooling down/sleeping that's when I usually end up sleeping with a dog under the covers with me or under a blanket on my lap.

thanks! i was actually just logging on to ask one more question - at what age can you start running smaller dogs? i had been planning to wait until he was around 18 months but don't know if i can start him earlier since he's smaller. i googled but no luck

your description sounds like teagan and luc. teagan wanders through rivers in the winter and sleeps in the snow and luc....not into sleeping in the snow. i'm hoping the new combo coat that covers his belly as well will help, and i'm hoping they'll custom size one for neb as well.

i've also decided on a new ground pad (for in the tent) for them while backpacking - i'll bring a couple. they're not too heavy: http://www.mec.ca/Products/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524442507417&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=2534374302701645&bmUID=1217985859002

and then i have a couple of fleece blankets i'll probably bring. luc and his cold intolerance caught me by surprise last november and then i didn't want to take him out on trips during real winter, so this fall/early winter will be a test for him as well as neb. hopefully i'll be a bit smarter this year

if he's still doing good at FR, despite being a little midget, we'll also be spending time training outside throughout the winter, though he will have car breaks as the different dogs are working, but i'll have to pay attention to how he handles the cold then as well.

Depends for my dogs on when they reliably loose lead heel while walking/fast walking with two other dogs . Stepping on a small dog is a bad idea... it's very expensive. I also don't bike with my tiny dogs, its just not worth the risk.

Usually by the time they're done growing at about 12 months (on the micro dogs) - 18 months on the not so micro dogs they're fine to do this.

that's a good point. the walks i do now with neb are fairly meandering and i don't worry about him heeling at all. we've started w/some fun obedience at FR, sit, heel (stationary, it's more a focus exercise at this point), but i haven't really pushed any obedience with him and have not worried about heeling yet. i hadn't thought of the stepping on thing! that would be terrible!

sounds like 18 months will still be the best bet to wait until for running. i'd rather not take chances.

thanks for your help