just asking this question on behalf of a friend.

she has fed grain-free kibble to her cats for about 3 years now (orijen).

one of her cats has been having difficulty urinating. her urinanalysis just came back negative for crystals (she wasn't clear if there is still the possibility of stones).

the vet was not happy that she was feeding a food that was not 'clinically proven' (i.e., hills prescription or medi-cal). he feels the food may be contributing and wants her to switch to hill's prescription cd (which is for cats w/crystals).

my friend wasn't real clear on exact vet details, but i think the vet suspects a UTI (wouldn't this show up in the urinanalysis? i don't know if they did a culture or not though). she has gotten antibiotics. he also, as mentioned, wants her to switch foods. well i'm not real clear on exactly what the vet has told her, i know this vet very well and while we obviously differ on food, he is an excellent clinician and surgeon, very thorough, one of the best vets i have ever met or dealt with.

ETA: apparently there was some inflammation in the urinary tract. my friend was worried this came about from washing her cat w/diluted baby shampoo (she's a persian or something and sometimes needs some help staying clean back there). i asked her where exactly the inflammation was, but she wasn't sure.

(i should note the vet had left a voicemail and it was on that basis she was speaking to me, so she hasn't had the opportunity to get proper detail)

does anyone have cats prone to crystals or UTIs that feeds grain-free? any thoughts/suggestions?

my understanding is a grain-free diet is probably better and safer for cats with respect to crystals and UTIs.

i was going to suggest to her that she consider adding cranberry to georgie (the cat)'s diet, and possibly apple cider vinegar if georgie will take it.

edit again:
i got her to forward me his voicemail. no sign of crystals, definite on inflammation and infection. she is to do the full course of antibiotics, and he wants her to switch foods (as mentioned) and then redo the urinanalysis in 4 weeks.

Dry food in general, contributes greatly to UTI/crystals in cats.

Wet food is considered healthier for cats, since the lack of moisture is a big concern.

I don't really know much about cat UTI's, but your friend needs to find a new vet. Cats are obligate carnivores (meat needs to make up most of their nutrition: even more so than dogs). I wouldn't think a UTI has to do with grain-free at all. I looked at science diet cat food and the only real source of meat for most of their foods is chicken by-product. Maybe the prescription form has both chicken and beef by-product but I wouldn't think it is much better.

As Alyssa said, wet food is much better for them.

UT Disorders: http://www.littlebigcat.com/index.php?action=library&act=show&item=017

Canned Food: http://www.littlebigcat.com/index.php?action=library&act=show&item=whycatsneedcannedfood

As far as keeping the cat clean, maybe trimming his (his? or her) private areas to make it easier to keep clean, and reduce bathing.

I second the new vet.

Orijen cat is a fine cat food.Better than most in magnesium and ash levels.

UTI crystals and stones happen. Sometimes they can be prevented, othertimes not at all. Genetics as well as other environmental factors can play a role in this issue.

I find it far more likely based upon the info provided the cat had a UT infection which was causing the issue. If it gets resolved within a few days I wouldn't do the followup UT test. Why is there a need?

Sadly with cats as well as dogs there is a debate going on proper feeding habits based upon commercial interests. Just as microsoft has become a sponsor with PC software users among the educated, pedigree has the corner on the shelters, and Science diet and eukanuba among the vet schools.

One of my cats had a urine blockage about 6 months ago. It was scary because when they aspirated his bladder it looked like pure blood. He was at the e-vet over the weekend and I was scared. At the time I was feeding mostly canned food and would give about 1 tablespoon of dry every night. After this incident I have pulled the dry completely and he has been fine (knocking on wood).

There is a great discussion forum for diabetic cats but if you do a search there is some good stuff about crystals. You have to sign up but it's worth it. I consider it to be the equivalent of the Leerburg forum but for cats:

http://www.yourdiabeticcat.com/

They also have a list of recommended foods.

I was reading one thread just now and someone recommended to stop feeding anything fish.

There is also great information at catinfo.org.

I hope your friends cat turns out okay.

 Quote: Jennifer Mullen

i was going to suggest to her that she consider adding cranberry to georgie (the cat)'s diet, and possibly apple cider vinegar if georgie will take it.

This is one thing I probably wouldn't do without the guidance of a good vet, Jenn. Altering the PH of the urine, even a little, could cause more problems.

Ditto what Alyssa said about wet food. My male cat who was blocked has been on raw for over a year with no more problems. What Melissa said is true, too. Some cats are more prone to UTIs and/or blockages...usually males, but not always.

Thanks guys.

I was thinking actually of recommending she try feeding THK Prowl - more for the hiding cranberry powder and apple cider vingegar (YECH), but Alyssa, good point. I promised to bring in the cranberry capsules I got when Teagan had an upset urinary tract to work tomorrow.

The vet is a very good vet, but he is VERY traditional w/respect to food and vaccinations - as long as you take that into account, he's great. This clinic was one of the vet clinics (still is) of the rescue I ran, and the vet is the owner and one of the best vets I've ever dealt with - given the volume of cats the rescue dealt with, I ended up seeing every vet we dealt with at every clinic make a mistake at some point - except for him. If he diagnoses something - well, a)I always know his reasoning; but in my experience he is extremely accurate. And I won't get into how much I respect him as a surgeon
But I agree, on food....eh. My friend is perfectly willing to disagree with him though

I'm thinking based on another conversation we had that the UTI is probably a result of the cat simply not keeping herself clean enough, and maybe the bath just exacerbated it. Keeping her trim is a great idea.

edit: oh, and i wasn't really sure what the follow-up test reasoning was either. i'm don't know everything they were looking at though, though i also don't see the point of it. was going to ask laura tomorrow what exactly that discussion was.

 Quote: Sarah Morris

 Quote: Jennifer Mullen

i was going to suggest to her that she consider adding cranberry to georgie (the cat)'s diet, and possibly apple cider vinegar if georgie will take it.

This is one thing I probably wouldn't do without the guidance of a good vet, Jenn. Altering the PH of the urine, even a little, could cause more problems.

Hmmm....that's not a bad point. When Teagan had her 'infection' (really her hips), my vet was like 'yeah, go ahead' but I already have had the discussion with Laura that dosage???? for a cat? I was wondering about swinging the pH too far in the wrong direction.

Amazingly, given everything I've done with cats, urinary tract infections/crystals are the one thing I've never had to deal with in my cats, foster cats, or feral/stray cats. It's one of the few medical problems I have no personal experience with (though we did treat Teagan for it until all the results came back negative and my vets looked at the x-rays the e-vet took and went 'well....uh....yeah, her hips - not good'.

There are other reasons for a UTI; has the cat been "holding" it for any reason? While I would go w/Prowl for more water, the typical FUS stuff is more of a male problem. Tell your friend that leaving food out all the time causes cats to produce some kind of chemical that leads to the production of crystals. Something to do w/smelling it all the time triggering a brain response....

Not sure about the holding; I'll ask her.

She told me this morning that Georgie did a normal pee in the litterbox, apparently she'd been dribbling around previously.

I didn't know that about leaving food out. I free feed my cats because my oldest is so old and has a couple of things wrong with him, but is also skinnier than he used to be (his weight is stable though). I always worry that he won't get enough food b/c the two younger cats are more robust unless I free fed.