Quote: jessicakromer

 Quote: melissa blazak

Swing is an obedience finish.

And that is what I have always heard it called, a finish...

Me too, and sometimes a "left finish."

Yep they tell us to finish. She goes to the left with "swing" and the right for "heel". Actually on the left she sits with her rear out too far so I'd like to go back to the other way we learned at Petsmart, going behind and sitting on the left. I don't see anyone else using the hand signals. Then I heard two of the advanced people talking saying they don't use the hand signals because you have to use either or in AKC obedience and they're afraid of the dog looking away and not seeing them. So I thought "well I should stop too." Since I plan on going to "rally night" as soon as we graduate again. I'd like her to eventually compete when they let mixed breeds in AKC competition. I still use them (hand signals) for stay and sit. Do you think it's beneficial to keep them for now? I found a squeaky toy and she laid right down on command. She knows what it means, just doesn't like it for some reason. That's why I wanted to repeat it, but I realize the session was definately counter productive. I'm planning on using this toy reward deal more often. I've read about people using them for Scht. training here on the board. We also learned a "Schtz turn" the other night. You turn left and the dog goes around right. She did that right away. (using abreviation cuz I'm not too certain on the correct spelling.)

 Quote: michelle pociask

She knows what it means, just doesn't like it for some reason.

I know I was not there, but I wish I could tell you how many people have said that (or similar), including myself, and in all these years (and I'm old! :grin, it has never turned out to be true. There's always been some element of confusion or misunderstanding or distraction, either all along or just introduced --- but not once a real matter of "s/he knows exactly how to do it but was just being stubborn."

Just sayin' ....

Frustration (human or dog) is always a signal to stop, before it becomes just shutting down.

I realize the frustration thing and at that point she didn't get it or was afraid or whatever. But she goes halfway sometimes and goes back up. Do you think she doesn't think I mean all the way down? That's why I like class because the instructor will see what I'm doing wrong. I often hold my arm wrong or do something wrong and with just a slight correction the dog get's what I'm asking. I'm going to have to pay special attention to what I'm doing and what the difference is when she goes all the way down and not. Good thing is I have class on Tuesday so they will be able to see what I do and tell me. She goes down for the down stay, I bet it's the hand signal thing. I bet she's not sure with just the voice command. At petsmart we did only hand signals in the end so the dog would have to watch you. Maybe changing has her confused as to what I want. Connie, the older the better, I respect people who have been doing it a long time (dog training that is ) the club I'm attending started in 1945 Dunes Dog Training Club. Most of the trainers are over 60 or close. Very good at what they do.

Michelle,

The thing about hand signals is that dogs are visual creatures, not verbal ones. So, if you teach the hand signal first, the dog will have much more trouble learning the verbal cue.

I like to fade lures as soon as possible, teach the verbal cue first, then introduce the hand signal. Once the dog understands both truly, either is sufficient. However, if you always (or mostly always) use them together, without teaching/proofing separately, you'll end up with a confused dog who will always need the signal help.

As far as the dog watching you, that is all focus work and making sure you're full of fun and great reinforcemnts for the dog.

leih

A finish can be made by the dog circling behind you or swinging to your left side. Hence the name swing finish. Then there is the flip finish, which is like a swing finish with ATTITUDE! The dog leaps in the air, twirls midair, to land in the sit at the heel position. It looks real impressive for a while, but not only is it easy for a misjudgement; but the dog tends over time to begin to over twirl and no longer end up in the correct position.