Hi All,
I just wanted to post and thank everyone for their previous posts which I've learned a lot from.
I took the plunge and bought an e-collar for my border-collie mix 2yo. My primary focus is for recalls. I adopted her 11 months ago, she was at least 1yo. and in need of tons of exercise yet had only potty training from what I could tell. Anyhow, we've gone to obedience class, and since we couldn't fit the obedience #2 class, tried some agility. She has adjusted well from a nervous barking wreck to a really fun dog. My biggest mistake was in allowing her off-leash so soon. (I knew it was a mistake at the time, but her exercise needs were so great I just couldn't exercise her without good walks in the woods off-leash) Anyhow, she stays with me mostly and comes 90% of the time when the walk is over. So.. of course this is unacceptable, and I fortunately found this site, Ed's DVD, and Dogtra outlet. Well, after 10 days where she wore the collar, and I trained myself, I finally got up the courage to use the collar and the long-line. Of course, she comes beautifully with the long-line 99% of the time so it was hard to set-up scenarios to practice. Finally, taking her out of the yard and into my neighbors, she got good and distracted, and I had to use the page and she came. Later, at the park, we practiced again, with a swamp nearby to entice her. This was a better source of distraction, and I had to nick her 2 or 3 times, and then that was it...we played ball for the rest of the time with another dog. On walks the next day, one small nick and one page, and she has been reliable. We will still work on this, but my goal is for her to come when we meet coyotes, horses, or other walking groups. So.. I think we are on the path to success.
One thing I've noticed: No one else in the northeast uses these collars and I feel a bit of the failure to having to "resort" to this. I can't/won't mention it to most dog people. Before the collar, I used constant positive marker training and credit marking to helping her to stop barking (She rarely barks at all now). But this recall issue was looming and I was trying to find a trainer to help me with the collar but trainers in the area only use "totally positive" training. When I first started in obedience classes, I had all of these issues, and no one could tell me what to do- only "click and treat" never any corrections. It was so frustrating!
Just thought I'd share the good and the bad. Also... this dog is so clever, I doubt the recall battle is over so... any advice will be welcome! Thanks for reading.

 Quote: sarah smith

One thing I've noticed: No one else in the northeast uses these collars and I feel a bit of the failure to having to "resort" to this.

New Englander here that uses the e-collar, Sarah! And I know plenty others that do too.

I started using the e-collar for recalls on off-leash walks in the woods. It worked like a charm and now that Ellie understands it -- just like a leash correction -- I use stim in many aspects of my training.

Katie

If the tool works for you, then use it. You are not abusing the dog, but simply using a training tool appropriately.

As for totally positive trainers. Have you noticed that many of these use head collars? The head collar gives constant corrections, so not adding more on top of it is hardly totally positive.

Markers and treats are a powerful training tool, but corrections have their place too!

Sarah, I live in the Northeast & my dogs never leave my property without e-collars on, as a backup. I have only had to use the nick a couple of times in 5 1/2 years, but it is there if I need it. I work my dogs on alot of the school sport fields,beachs & other public places (never dog parks)& there are always dogs there that the owners have little to no control over. I want to be sure that I have the odds in my favor should something occur. My dogs are well trained on recall, under very heavy distraction, but there may come the time....... I would rather be safe & know that I have that extra tool if needed.

There are people out there using e-collars, but most that I know are working dog people. Although I do know a few people that were encouraged to use e-collars by their dog trainers because they didn't want to take the time to train properly & wanted a quick fix. Poor dogs. Unfortunately, it can be an abusive tool in the wrong, untrained hands like many other things.

Hey there, I also live in New England and just purchased an e-collar and the DVD for my two dogs. I'm glad to hear it's working for you, I'm currently in the conditioning phase, and working on mastering the come with a long line. I was actually introduced to e-collar training by a neighbor, whose dog walked with her without a leash with 100% obediance. She sent her dog to boot camp, but I don't want that for my dogs, but I DO want total recall. I'd love to hear how it continues to work for you, and what kind of problems you run into. Like you, I run my very energetic dogs in the woods where we will meet other dogs, deer, horses, moose, etc. That's when it gets tough!

Yup, an e-collar using New Englander here too. I will admit they are a rare sight, but without it my dog would never get off-leash. I would rather use the e-collar and have a little fun. My dog has fabulous recall, but loves squirrels just a little too much. A few people have asked me about the collar, but not many.

I made mine (Dogtra) pretty with a lime green cinch it collar for the receiver, and a lime-patterned lanyard I bought here at LB that actually coordinates nicely for the transmitter (my poor male dog!). I've had WAY more comments about how neat it looks than questions about what it actually is!

Works for me!

Hi All,
So great to hear of others. I am enjoying having more confidence/freedom with Ellie. (Yes, another awesome Ellie!) We don't have dog parks in my town, and technically have a leash law, but all dog owners so far have been careful about when and where they let their dogs run. I think that was the point of the law anyhow. I, also, took Ed's advice regarding the cinch collar. (after using olive oil to get the device on the collar!) Ellie's leash is attached to it and it's a part of going to have fun for her.
We are not ready yet, but I didn't see any advice on how to train her to be with me off-leash walking. Is there a video or instruction somewhere on this site? I have been slowly marking "heel" and she easily jogs with me on a leash at a heel, but walking and heeling consistently are still a struggle even on a leash. I would like to guide her to be better so my neighbor can walk her when I can't. I have tried all of my obedience class guidelines such as change directions, stop and wait for her to lessen the pull.. These do work! Yet, I've been doing them since Jan. 15th, with good results, but not perfect results yet! No... I haven't bought a prong collar. She usually only pulls for the first quarter to a half of a mile. Anyhow, nice to "meet" you all!

 Quote: Sarah Smith

(Yes, another awesome Ellie!)

Awesome! Pictures, please! Did you post an intro.-- there is a special section of the forum for that that.

I use the e-collar more for recalls on off-leash hiking or snowshoeing in the woods and for competition heeling. My casual walks out and about are always on leash so I'm not sure how to direct you there -- I'm sure others will advise.

Katie

I haven't gotten the pics from my phone yet, but will once I get a new card reader. But... thought I'd update those who were curious as to how things have gone after one week.
1. I'm still just using the collar for recalls but am looking into it for dog-dog aggression, and will ask questions on the appropriate forum.
2. The other day, my neighbor's dog dug herself out, and I thought "Great! I can practice recalls with a good distraction!" So I let Ellie out (it's a relatively safe side-street with empty lots). Anyhow, Riley, my neighbors' under-exercised boxer, came and then I focused on Ellie who by now was quite excited about something and ignored the page, I went to a nick, and turned the remote off accidently. After figuring this out, Ellie came with no problem.
3. Mostly, Ellie has been coming on just my whistle. This morning, it was quite windy and my whistle was failing, and I was glad for the page!
4. I've decided to just continue with marker training on the loose-leash walking since she has been showing some improvement lately.

Hope everyone had a nice Thanksgiving, Sarah