I've been wondering about this ever since I first started training this behaviour with Jethro. I'm using the command, Focus, for eye contact - that is, Jethro looking me in the eye. I was taught in obedience class, that I should build duration of the focus, getting Jethro to give me longer and longer eye contact. I love it when he gives me his check in - he really looks into my eyes and makes a connection with me. But after a certain period, not very long, I start to feel uncomfortable, like I am making him stare at me, and that is something that goes against dog etiquette. When dogs stare at each other they are not indicating comfort or trust.

Can anyone comment on this? I have no idea how long I should be asking Jethro to give me direct eye contact. But there seems to be a point that it is crossing a line away from trust building and connecting and into that whole 'dominance' thing.

I've never reached that point with Koenig... I don't think it really works like that in marker training, but I don't know.

Koe will stare at me for minutes on end. Eventually I get tired of it. Ideally, you're able to compete (for example) an obedience routine without the dog looking away from your face.

Jenny, when you teach him "Focus," are you standing in just one spot the whole time? How close are you? On or off leash? What I have learned from my obedience trainers is you start off easy, standing close to the dog, on leash. Like you said, build duration gradually. For a beginner dog, there is nothing wrong with giving an intermediate bridge like "Gooooood boy, thaaaaat's it," or whatever you want to say besides your marker word.

I think just standing in one spot and staring at the dog might make some dogs uncomfortable, but I try to keep it interesting for the dog. I stand close, then far away, maybe even off leash if your dog is that far along. I move slowly from one side of the dog to the other, asking him to follow me with his eyes as I move. With mine, I'm to the point that I ask them to watch me as I walk completely around them, which requires of course, a brief look away while the dog turns his head after I come around his back. (This assumes I'm incorporating a stay into it. It's not necessary for a dog to stay perfectly still when using the "Focus" command. In fact, you are eventually going to want him to watch you at the heel. So for a beginner dog, I wouldn't confuse him with "Focus" and "Stay" at the same time.)

Eventually, when he's getting really good, try proofing some distractions. Stand in front of him with a toy in each hand. After asking him to "Focus," slowly bring your arms up. The idea is to get him to watch your face, not the toys. When he's good at that, do the same thing but drop the toys when your arms get horizontal. You can also have a helper drop something or make some other kind of distraction, like throwing a piece of crumpled notebook paper at him.

These are just a few things I have been taught to do to make it interesting and challenging for the dog. And lastly, of course, be aware of your facial expression. Dogs communicate with body language and expression far more than we do, so try not to look like you're challenging him, but rather having fun with him. (Not saying you were, but sometimes we don't realize what others see in our expression.)

Sorry this was a little long-winded. Good luck!

 Quote: Jenny Arntzen

Can anyone comment on this? I have no idea how long I should be asking Jethro to give me direct eye contact. But there seems to be a point that it is crossing a line away from trust building and connecting and into that whole 'dominance' thing.

I don't think you can compare the two (dogs staring in a challenging way, and your dog giving good focus)

When a dog stares in a challenging way, it's not just the fact that he's staring at the other dog; it's his body and tail stance, ear position, etc, that is challenging.

When you teach focus and your dog is looking in your eyes/face, you are not projecting the same body language (or you shouldn't be ) ; be aware of the expression in your eyes (soft) and what you are doing with your face (soft, slight smile, etc...)

This is good. I am going to add in some variations as we gaze lovingly into each other's eyes. I have been practicing with him outside, and starting to use it in slightly distracting situations. We have a long way to go, I'm starting over again with him because way back at the beginning I did not understand what I was doing and pretty much taught Jethro to 'avoid Focus' rather than Focus.