When woking on obedience using food, do you withhold other types of treats like Bully Sticks? Can you occasionally offer those when the pup will perform the expected task - sit/down/stand/whatever?

 Quote: john ralston

When woking on obedience using food, do you withhold other types of treats like Bully Sticks? Can you occasionally offer those when the pup will perform the expected task - sit/down/stand/whatever?

John, are you marker training?

Marker training doesn't really involve a treat that the dog takes away and spends time with.

Tell us how you're training.

In addition to what Connie said, look at one as a "reward' for a behavior and the other as unearned enjoyment.
I rarely give something for nothing. Thus few "treats".

Marker training with food treats as shown on the Michael Ellis videos.

The Bully Sticks would only be awarded after doing "something", but not sure if the task would warrant a reward of such degree, so I will have to evaluate how I deal with that.

For now, I will refrain from giving treats, as the pup hasn't had them yet.

You could ask for any behavior before giving the Bully Stick or other chewy. I always ask for something first.

I don't see it as a marker reward, except maybe a jackpot, but even a jackpot is something I want to be there with the dog for, whether it's lots of food rewards or a big play session .....



I certainly do give such big items, and require something first, but it doesn't really fit into teaching a new command for me. I am interested in reading others' comments.

 Quote: john ralston

... For now, I will refrain from giving treats, as the pup hasn't had them yet.

You haven't loaded your marker, then?

You are watching a Michael Ellis DVD (maybe #220, Power of Training with Food?) but have not begun?

 Quote: john ralston

When woking on obedience using food, do you withhold other types of treats like Bully Sticks? Can you occasionally offer those when the pup will perform the expected task - sit/down/stand/whatever?

Let me start over.

I'm almost always working on some kind of command with food.

I do not withhold big chewy items. They don't fit into my marker sessions, but I do give them sometimes, and I ask for something first.

There, maybe I finally got it straight.

I have seen that giving a reward that takes more than a quick swallow causes a time lapse during training that is not helpful.

This is sort of a "me too" post, but Connie did say she was interested in reading others' comments.

For me, a "training session" is five, ten, maybe fifteen minutes long, depending on the age and attention span of the dog. The treats I use during a training session (and of course I'm talking about marker training here) are always of the tiny, quickly consumed variety. Something along the lines of the Zuke's Mini Naturals or hot dogs quartered the long way, then sliced into about 1/4 inch pieces is the size I'm talking. This size is perfectly appropriate even for large dogs.

My dogs do occasionally get the "bigger treats," meaning something that will take longer to consume, like a bully stick or a stuffed Kong, but I do not use these as training rewards in any way. These are typically given when I want the dog to be occupied for a while, i.e., I'm busy working, or the weather is very nasty and we temporarily can't get outside for play or exercise, or in the case of a puppy, I'm working on crate training and want to give him something to occupy him in the crate. While I may ask the dog to sit or down before just handing the treat over, I do not really consider this a training session.

Hope that helps.

I guess I should have been clearer - I would NOT use it during a training session.

My question was really if it is OK to give the pup a chew treat in the house, if the dog is being trained with a marker/food program.

 Quote: john ralston

I guess I should have been clearer - I would NOT use it during a training session.

My question was really if it is OK to give the pup a chew treat in the house, if the dog is being trained with a marker/food program.

Well, then I guess the responses covered it. LOL

I do give occasional chewies, I ask for something for it (or for anything I give) first, and I think of them as unrelated to the food rewards in marker training.