Quote: Ariane Gauthier

Other then back on a longer drag line, more recall work, maybe yummier treats. What can I do before the e-collar come out.

If he already knows about the recall, then I don't think there is a reason not to introduce low level e collar training to proof it. I am a firm believer in teaching a dog a behavior with markers and rewards on leash or long line first, and only introducing correction once you know beyond a shadow of a doubt that he knows what the cue means. At that point if he doesn't listen he's just blowing you off cause he found something better than your rewards, in Lucifer's case - prey animals. So buy Ed Frawley's e-collar for the pet owner DVD and use it to bomb proof his recall. Still use rewards when he comes, but low level e collar use will teach him that he can't just ignore you when he finds something he thinks is better.

If you are worried about using corrections at his young age, you shouldn't be - you aren't going to break his tender puppy spirit as long as you are being smart and fair about the timing and severity of the corrections, and only use them if you KNOW he knows what you are asking of him and he is just choosing not to listen. If you show him this at this point in his training, you are being *more* clear about boundaries than you would be were you to draw this process out until he is older. Age doesn't factor in to ecollar training so much as how well do they understand what you are asking of them, and how fairly you are dealing out the level of correction, and the reward:punishment ratio, in my opinion.