Sara,
Sounds like you are doign fine to me, good to talk with breeders.... I think the main noticable diffrence in working lines and show lines is the head. Working lines tend to have a strong thick heads that look like you could smack it with a brick and the dog would go "yes"?, as show types tend to have a weak looking long head that looks like it would break if you pettted it to hard.

Second diffrence is coat type.. I wodl say the majority of good working dogs I have seen are sable coated "Like Ed's" or solid black, I have seen a few with the standard saddle black and tan ones, don't get me wrong... but the majority are the others.

You seem to be in the same boat as I was, "mabey" try Schutzhund... I choose a midrange drive pup for my first dog, so that I could gain experence and not mess up a truly great working dog, I choose a hard dog "one that can take a really hard correction and forgive me for it straight away" Thank god I did, I have made a few mistakes hahah, but around the house he is just as calm as can be, lays there most of the time waiting at every doorway till I do something.. he is a dream house dog, as well as good on the field, a perfect mixture I ended up with I did "Yoda Quote"

I would further say the GSD will require a min of 1 hour total good exercise "puppy exempt" a day, not just a walk I mean hard running and chasing stuff and playing and walking to cool off. Two hours is about right for my dog. I split it all up into several play sessions throughout the day, not all at once.. lol

I hope that all helps in some way.

 Quote:

They have the pedigree for the parents for me to look.

This will tell you a lot. Photo's can be hard to really see the differences in the AM and German until you get "the eye" not to mention in the win photos you only see a side view. To me, the am- breds look like they were pushed through a crank press, and often are somewhat oversize in height/length.

With pedigrees, don't just assume that because it has a german looking name it is a german kennel. Easiest way to tell if the dog is working line is the letters after the names on the pedigree. If you see CH, CAN-CH, or International CH, before the name, run, do not walk the other way. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Those are AKC championship titles and have no bearing on the working ability of the dog, or the temperment of the dog. Most importantly, they do not in anyway guarantee the health of the dog as some of these breeders would attest.

Another important note is are the parent's titled? If not, why are they breeding them? The only legit reason to breed is to improve the breed, and with out a performance title of some kind, (herding, tracking, Schutzhund,etc) there is no proof outside of the owners world that the dog is breed worthy. Another point is that these titles alone also do not make a dog breed worthy.

just my $.02

You definitely want a working line dog, based on my experiences. I have a German showline GSD. I researched and knew that I DID NOT want an American type dog, but the working lines were hard to find in my area and I ended up with a show line dog since she was supposed to be just a pet. Well, turns out that we are her pets. As a pup Auster had a bladder infection so we gave her antibiotics, took urine samples, etc. Then she had demodex, so we put creams on her. Now she has pannus that will one day blind her and requires daily eye drops ($30 a bottle). Three weeks ago she bloated and had torsion ($1,600 surgery). She's acting just fine (most dogs don't survive), but I'm hoping that the awful gas will end in a few more weeks (I've been giving her probiotics, but I will start adding digestive enzymes as well).

I'd much rather spend time exercising a dog than medicating it and working to pay for the next surgery. Her breeder certified hips, I saw her mother and grandmother and both were happy and healthy, and her breeder kept track of the pups. It wasn't because of what he did, the show lines are just more prone to problems. That's not to say that working lines are perfect, but you certainly have a much better chance with them. At least the vets like Auster :rolleyes: . They all say that she's the best shepherd that they have seen; she acts just like a lab! I guess that's a good thing since she's only 3 1/2 and will almost certainly be having several more health problems before her most likely early death. I just try to enjoy every day with her now and I am hoping to get a summer job with a vet so that I can get an employee discount on her health care (even had we bought pet insurance she'd be close to her lifetime cap).

After having Auster, I don't think that I can bring myself to own another GSD. I love her, but I can't deal with the problems and heartache again. I know that the working lines are completely different, but somehow owning another dog of the same breed just isn't something that I know I can do again.

D wrote: "If you wish, private mail me and I'll send you the name of a breeder that has a 'pet line' of German-line German Shepherds. They have selected for a bit milder attitude in their pet line."

I'm sorry, but I really hate to see that kind of breeding. If people want a companion breed get one, don't get a working breed. GSDs should be a working breed, period.

My own elitist view.

Just about anyone can train a well selected working line dog to be a pet, it doesn't take much more work than with a putzy dog. In fact I think it takes the same amount of work that you should be putting in any energetic pet companion.

The drive and aggressions that are genetic to the working lines have to be selectively encouraged in most pups from the time they are brought home. If you want a pet you can curb that behavior in a well selected working line dog very easily. If you want a GSD you need to get a working line dog. That is what a GSD is.

Am I ranting here? I know I am repeating myself.

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

I have a german show/working line cross. He is wonderful with the kids and no health problems so far. I train in SAR and he has excellent drives for my purposes.
Am dogs often (not always look like they are walking on their hocks and have weaker temperments. I used to show Great Danes at AKC shows and swore I would never get a German SHepherd because of the temperments of the show dogs, absolutly awful, and because I did not want a dog that looked so UNNATURAL. Well, here I am with a german line dog and love him to death. Good luck in your search!

Naa VanCamp,

You are right on all points I think, what you are saying makes perfect sense to me anyway.

Here is an article by Fred Lanting, gives some background re: am/german gsd
http://www.gsdhelpline.com/fred3.htm

GSD thro the centuries

http://www.gsdhelpline.com/ages.htm