Jose, one thing to remember about watching a video is that they can be edited to look like anything they want.
We have a couple of Presas at our club. One young bitch has really nice drive, both in obedience work, and in bite work. The bite work is prey only at this point, and she loves it. The other two....well, the're Presas, and don't seem all that interested in prey work. Their defence seems to be right on the edge and is handled very carefully.

Jose,
I've run off Police Patrol dogs during helper work on occasion, and very rarely am I ever asked to really test a dog in defense, because I can put a significant percentage of dogs into flight, ie, leaving the field, if the owners ask that their dog be tested to real world standards. Bernhard also demonstrated the same concept at the last Flink's seminar, and he could have crumbled most of the dogs in the seminar, had he chose to - which is why it's good for a handler to be realistic about their dog, and not ask for more intense defensive work from a decoy than their dog can handle.
That's why I'm such a stickler about ppd's, just because I've seen so many of them fail. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

And I've seen *multiple* dogs from red-star kennel first hand that were maybe pet-grade, if you were kind. Those owners had been overcharged thousands of dollars for what they got, they could have done nearly as well picking up a dog at the humane society.
Maybe red-star has produced some good dogs, but of the dogs that I've seen from that kennel, there were none that I'd own.

It all depends on what you think you're seeing on a video, I guess. The experienced trainer that I mentioned before had a video from a red-star kennel seminar, and they said that they were "semi-horrified" ( their words )

Jose, honestly bud, *I'm* not the one trying to sell you a dog here. I don't make any profit from telling you this, and I'll likely end up getting hate E-mails from those folks regarding my views. But I'm giving you my direct observations of both the breed and the dogs that I've seen that kennel produce, and I take PPD training more seriously than most people in this country do.

With you being in New York, let me think for a bit, I know of some true ppd's in the New England area that maybe you could go see ( a famous Mal named Kirk comes to mind. That dog is beyond frightening, I kid you not, and I'm a hard man to scare, believe me )

Jose, On the other hand you could do like a lot of people I have met over the years and just do what you want. When I started training dogs people did'nt give you advice like this, they let you screw up, and then maybe told you how to go about things. I saw a red star presa when I was in San Antonio recently. He was fun to work with. BUT you could always get the pup that doesn't work. Trust me that really sucks. I don't know Will at all but after reading a billion posts I don't think he's going to type responses just to pull your chain.

Jose,
Just a quick question to you to put things in perspective. Have you ever owned and managed a large breed dog with the "possible" temperment issues that one may find in the Presna Canario.
Being a New Yorker as you are, I see to many large difficult dogs falling into the hands of people that have no clue to the responsibilities that come with dogs that have the capabilities of the Presna. Sorry if I am being presumtious.
Jerry

Hi Will
Can you please tell me what you do to bring out the defense in a dog and make most of them run off a field. Do you wear equipment or not.Are the dogs with their handlers? etc. I dont want to try it. Just curious. BTW love your posts very honest.
thanks Paula

Wow that is a lot to handle in one bite...

I owned a rotty for ten years. I had to put him down because of cancer a few months ago. My family and I thought it was time for a new dog. We live in the upper east side of Manhattan in a very safe building. Ever since Niko's death I haven't felt calm and my children don't want to sleep in there rooms, which are on the other side of the apartment. This is fine by me because I didn't feel at ease with them sleeping so far away without Niko to watch over them. Niko always slept right outside their doors. Any time one of our children got up in the middle of the night for any reason Niko always followed and although we could not hear the kids, we always herd Niko( 140lb)... He was crazy over our kids and we were crazy over him..

Thanks everyone for all your advice.

p.s Will,, I am building a house in Connecticut. I am always going up there on weekends to see the progress. Let me know Thanks..


Niko's pics:

http://share-dell.shutterfly.com/osi.jsp?i=EeAMmLFwxcOWziI&notag=1

Hi Will
Can you please tell me what you do to bring out the defense in a dog and make most of them run off a field

He probably just stare at the dog in the eyes and thinking in his head he is about to have this dog for dinner. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

??? Somewhere I got the impression that Red Star is no longer in business and the owner had returned to Russia.

He probably just stare at the dog in the eyes and thinking in his head he is about to have this dog for dinner. I guess i would probably run away too. LOL.