Along these lines, do you believe it would be ethical to breed an outstanding working dog for which there was no information regarding the dog's lineage?
Just to be the devils advocate for a second. How do you think these breeds got started? What if the dog in question was everything you could ever ask for? Is paperwork your concern? All breeds were pretty much started with dogs who were everything the guy wanted right?
Is the German import male that your "acquaintance" has titled? How did his hip x-ray come out?
You mention that he's "schutzhund trained", but has he gotten the titles yet?
Jenn Kavanaugh Webboard User Reg: 01-05-2004
Posts: 560
Loc: Bushkill, PA
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What if the dog in question was everything you could ever ask for? Is paperwork your concern? All breeds were pretty much started with dogs who were everything the guy wanted right?
Think the 'not knowing' has more to do with the OTHER dogs in the lines, not the wonderful dog you love that is perfect and standing in front of you.
New dog lines do start with unpapered dogs but hopefully some knowledge of where the dogs come from. Health and temperment issues going back on BOTH sides are so important to know. Specially so you can continue to breed to strengthen the good things in the lines and breed out the bad. If every litter ends up being a complete surprise (and maybe a bad surprise), not a good breeding program.
Intelligent dogs rarely want to please people whom they do not respect --- W.R. Koehler
Just to be the devils advocate for a second. How do you think these breeds got started? What if the dog in question was everything you could ever ask for? Is paperwork your concern? All breeds were pretty much started with dogs who were everything the guy wanted right?
The question was: 'for which there was no information regarding the dog's lineage'
It said nothing about 'registration papers'. Papers don't make a dog...but lineage does. Big difference. To clarify...90% of KNPV or NVBK dogs don't have FCI registration papers...BUT LINEAGE is well known and documented and breedings carefully planned out based on each dog's extrinsic traits and intrinsic ones ie., genealogy.
Back to the original question...IF there is NO info on the LINEAGE of the dog (not talking about papers here)...then no, breeding is not a consideration. Even when starting a new breed...one must have something fundamental to begin with...and a good starting point is 'genetics'.
Now allow me to be the devil's advocate....given you know nothing about a given dog but what you see externally...How do YOU decide whether what you're seeing is not more the result of 'nurture' as opposed to 'nature'?? I've seen some incredible 'point' dogs; whom I'd never consider breeding to...but credit was due to the great imprinting, upbringing, training, and handling...It's not atypical of an excellent European (or other) trainer to make a 'good' dog look 'great' during a routine...'Substance' of a dog is a measure of his GENETICS as well as his environment. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
The easy out would be that I would not use a "points" dog for breeding. I would want to work the dog myself. I would probably do something "outside the box" to see how the dog responded. This I feel is easier to do in Shutzhund than ring, but mostly because at 41 I can't move as well, not to mention I am rather green at the sport. I also like to take the dogs down a dark alley or path and depending on what I saw, or thought I saw would have the bad guy closer/further when the attack happened. I like a dog that goes out of his way to make you feel that bite while in the suit. I like dogs that look at you while doing the bitework.I don't like dogs that don't. I also like them to fight you to the point of being hard to control in other words you control how much fight you give them that is how easy it is to get the out or obedience. I like to see a dog that is confident in everyday occurances. I don't like overt dog aggression. I prefer a dog that doesn't care about inconsequential stuff like that. I do like dogs that are a bit forward with other people, I guess they call it rank here but not a lot.
Along these lines, do you believe it would be ethical to breed an outstanding working dog for which there was no information regarding the dog's lineage?
Answer: NO
So if the dog could type 100 wpm, speak three languages and do your tax return you wouldn't breed the dog? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
>>So if the dog could type 100 wpm, speak three languages and do your tax return you wouldn't breed the dog?
***Nope...Still wouldn't breed him...then I'd CLONE him for a mere $32,000 USD...Why risk any variance of breeding??!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />
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