Hello...newbie here to the forum as well as training a puppy, and I was hoping to get some help here. First, the dog; we have a 5 month old Bijon Frise that we are crate training. The dog has been pretty good in this regard thus far (she's pooped in the crate once and hasn't since), and when we leave her in the crate during the day (we both work at least 8 hours a day, I come home once to take her out for a while), she seems to be pretty well adjusted except for the expected crying and barking when we leave. We ignore that.
The problem we have with her is that we started training her with the potty pads which was obviously a mistake.
When outside, no matter how long we have her out, she will not go potty. She still pees in the house, but no no. 2. The most progress we have made is having her go in the gargage in the potty pads. She will go no. 2 with no problem there; not on the pads, but everywhere else, and then in 3-4 places. I've caught her in the process of peeing in the house a few times, immediately scold her, then take her outside, to no avail. I then take her in the garage, and she goes.
Bottom line is we are confused as to what it will take to get her to understand that it's ok to go potty outside. When outside, I've tried to take the pads, potty training spray, treats, etc...nothing has worked. I run her for a while, and nothing. It seems as if she is so curious as to what smells the outside world has to offer, she's too busy and curious to even think about going potty. My wife is to the point where she thinks that even lots of exercise will not work. Morning are an issue as waiting outside for 45 mins to no avail has become tedious, so we rarely keep her outside in the morning for more than 10 mins.
Could it be that we're not cleaning up the pee adequately? I've read here that some of the commercial sprays are watered down and don't work as well as they used to...
Any advice?

if he doesnt go outside when you want him to put him back in his crate and try again later. play with him inside the house ONLY after he went potty outside.learn when your dog normaly has to go, my dog goes potty 30 minutes after every meal right after he wakes up etc. they will catch on quick just as long as you crate train him and if he doesnt go outside when you want him to you put him back in his crate and try again a hour or whatever later. the more times he goes in the house i guarantee you the longer it will take before he learns .do you keep his water and food out all the time? at my house i control all of that too if he eats and drinks all day long he will poop and pee all day long too

My suggestion.. can you and your wife take a few days off of work? If so, then the very first day, first thing in the morning, get her on leash and stand outside with her. It may take forever, perhaps an hour or so, but don't do anything with her (no talking, petting, playing, etc) until she eliminates outside. As soon as she starts, praise quietly to not interrupt the behavior, then when she's finished, explode into a praise/play machine. Exercise her a bit, then bring her back in the house and crate her or tie her to you. If she gets fed in the morning, then when she's done bring her back out and repeat. Eventually she'll make the connection that peeing outside is a very good thing since she gets great playtime afterwards. But no play/treats/anything until she does!

Definitely make sure you're cleaning up every single spot in the house. Dogs know all too well what you've missed.

Exactly as Diana said!

If you do not solve this immediately, you will end up with a dog like mine - the dog will learn to pee on clothes, rugs, anything soft that absorbs liquid so it delays you finding the mess and your disapproval. The dog will learn to hold it until you aren't looking, and if that is in the crate, the dog will begin to potty in the crate.

It's a nasty problem and Diana was completely right about the solution - however be prepared to wait 5 - 6 hours outside with the dog - or even more!

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.....The problem we have with her is that we started training her with the potty pads which was obviously a mistake. ......
Any advice?

I agree 110% with Anne and Diana. I made this mistake with my very first dog (as an adult, I mean), and I was lucky enough to have a trainer who told me the right thing.

Eventually, if you stay out there with her long enough, she's gonna have to go, and then, exactly as Diana said, when it's done, you teach her that she just did the best thing in the world and has pleased you no end.

This was 25+ years ago, but I think I recall that it was over with in one weekend, with lots of patience and lots of being outdoors.

You can do this!

Oh -- and I think that white vinegar in the cleaning water for the accident areas inside helps with the odor-elimination.

Thanks for the feedback everyone...these are all things that I've been reading about and trying to put into practice, but it looks like we just haven't been trying hard enough. Bottom line is, and tell me if I'm correct;

keep her in the crate, and if we let her out, it's to go to the bathroom outside until she goes, or to walk around in the house but being watched like a hawk.

Today I learned the hard way that not even knowing where she is for a few minutes ends in an accident that requires you to keep in mind that it's not the dog's fault, it was ours for not watching her.

Thanks again

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or to walk around in the house but being watched like a hawk.

..I do hope that translates into "kept on a six foot leash held onto by myself or my wife." <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Remember that a bichon pup's bladder is extremely small. She could start going and be done with it before you even notice what she's doing. By then it's just too late, which could explain why you weren't successful when you've scooted her outside when you caught her in the act.

Crate her, then take her out, and only have her out in the house on a leash after she does her business! Since you both work, you have to be perfect in the method from here on out especially if you take time off to get her used to pottying outside without holding out for hours. Buckling down with crating/keeping her on leash now will pay off later when you know the second you bring her out, she thinks about pottying.

Good luck! Stick with the program and you and your pup will be successful <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I also love the "hurry up" method, described elsewhere, where you use the same phrase every time the pup goes, and eventually, he/she goes at that phrase. We use "hurry up" and our little pup goes on command now...he looks up for his treat or praise immediately following!

Small dogs like a Bichon represent a different challenge. I have found that if the small pup does not go, I would rather put him back in the crate until he goes. The little ones seem to learn that there will be no fun play time until he goes...Bichons are smart dogs and she should learn quickly.

By blaming ourselves, we really take responsibility and get a good routine going...later, you will be glad. It is not pleasant to walk into a house where the folks have a small breed who is not housebroken. I couldn't live like that. The crate is the best answer....our little guy isn't fond of grooming time and runs into his crate when he sees the brush...and playfully pokes his head out to play.

He watches our shepherd do the jumps outside and now my wife has lowered the bar jump to about 3" off the ground. He proudly jumps over and looks up for his treat or praise...really funny.

Little dogs are fun...just more of a challenge to housebreak...little bladders mean more diligence on our part.

Keep us updated!