What are some good ways to start training a dog to bark and hold?
Be as specific as possible please, I would like to hear of different methods from start to finish. Keep in mind that I'm looking towards a strong bark and not a "prey bark".

Thanks <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Hi John,
I do not know how other people train bark n hold, but it starts, in my case, when dog is still a pup about 4 mos old. I train it as fun, and because the dog is still a pup I stay in the prey "zone", and I can not expect anything else than fun that can yet come to a "serious hold".
I make my pup bark, I teach him bark first, just yaping like crazy, my advice also teaching him "shut it" will help later <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />. Then I add sit and that is combined together. I usualy hold "treat" in the begining ( I do not use a lot of treats, more voice) later toy, depends on the pup.
And I practice every day for a little bit.He will now sit and bark every time I say revir I also added leather tug the other day and he will get it when he sits and barks.
I worked him blind only once, havent try bark and hold yet but IMO, it is too soon. I just leave him "alone" to do prey work with blind included, we do not search or anything else, just playing with tug and blind. I will add the hold n bark later when I see he can focus on that command and he does not develop habit of touching the sleeve.
Hope it makes sence.
I would teach bark first add sit and separate these two. My pup in down position commanded "bark" will stay down, I say revir he automaticaly sits and barks.
These commands are fun to teach, he does not have much focus yet, so all this is very short and a lot of happy praising, in my case.
And I would start the same way with an older dog. It works for me.
Just making it fun makes the training fun, if there is too much pressure in the beginning the dog can make mistakes like touching the sleeve or even biting it without barking, later down the road. At least that is what happend to me with my first female. I messed it up with pushing her too hard, too soon. And it was hard to brake her out of the bad habits, I practicaly started from the beginning..
Have fun <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Hi John,

only advice that worked for me -
take it slowly, first teach dog to bark and shut up on command as Martina allready said. What i am doing now is basically 'no bite' command - you have to let your dog vent some way or the other. Barking is best (if you don't like rolls or removing your dog from your own thigh <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

Again, i am blessed with a dog that will bark nicely at decoy and mind my commands, dog i had was too much for me at a time (Lima), but she just is like that ('Rain Man').... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

We probably didn't go about it the best way, but...
we taught him the bark and hold starting with his defensive / civil work without equipment - this was around when he turned 2 yrs old. So "Revier" became the watch word meaning he was supposed to be on alert. A strong, aggressive bark sent the decoy away to win the fight. We did do some work with hidden sleeves at this point but probably not necessary for teaching the bark and hold this way, but if he was able to get the bite we let him have it at first. Later, we taught him that "revier" would mean go to decoy and the blind, but not bite - and distinguished it from "Packen" where he has free reign to hit the decoy hard. I did this with two leashes - one on a harness and another on the prong to give the right control, but it might be useful to have a second person helping to handle the dog.

FWIW, the dog had already played the game of barking to get the decoy to move when he was much younger, so that experience didn't preclude him from building a more aggressive bark and hold later (although I suspect we didn't do it enough to really make it a foundational thing for him)

We're still working through it (defense of handler drills have been taking most of the time lately), but he's getting the idea. Am sure that others here will know a lot more about perfecting the bark and hold.

To mention things I wouldn't use... One of the Schutzhund training books I have mentioned the old method of getting the dog used to hitting the sleeve, then sending the dog 25 ft to the decoy with a tie 24 ft long... ouch! talk about not building trust with your dog!

But that IS one of the ways to do skin the cat...

For some dogs it would do very nicely. For others if you have brains you would not do it....

For go, go, go, go, dogs you can use that method (among 1001 other <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />, i have used it to teach 'idi'(voraus?). Not method i would use with my current dog, but THAT dog could handle it. We could go on and on subject are dogs getting weaker or are trainers getting better...

OK, i am very interested in 'no bite' excercises in bite dog sports. How do you people do it? Just force it on the dog? Or never let him/her bite after 'no bite' commnd? (i have seen dutch decoys run out of field and mix with crowd to not give dog chance to bite and 'self reward'...

I've tried getting my 5 month old pup to bark for the sleeve, which by the way he almost chokes to death while pulling, with no success. I would do all sorts of things to tease him, but he wouldn't even YAP!!! My female, I had no problem doing that.. she barked her head off when I did that... My male pup does have a nice defensive bark if he sees a stranger coming from the distance at night..

I welcome all suggestions. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

 Quote:

I've tried getting my 5 month old pup to bark for the sleeve, which by the way he almost chokes to death while pulling, with no success.

Try putting him in a harness to eliminate the choking.
http://www.leerburg.com/799.htm

If he's too small for this harness, there are several other places (on-line) where you can get adjustable nylon versions that are suitable for puppies. PM me if you need more info for that.

I can borrow my friend's harness. It fitted him perfectly 2 weeks ago.. I plan on getting the harness later on..At least once he's big enought for the Agitation Harness.

He ISN'T barking!!! He pulls like a mule and wouldn't bark.
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Consider doing nothing.
He's five months he shouldn't be displaying any more than prey at this point.
If he is doing really well in his bitework at five months it may be time to focus on other things and allow the dog to grow up enough to present a different face to the work.....you say you don't want a prey bark and want some power. Have some patience and allow maturity to provide your dog with the tools with which to do it.

 Quote:

What are some good ways to start training a dog to bark and hold?
Be as specific as possible please, I would like to hear of different methods from start to finish. Keep in mind that I'm looking towards a strong bark and not a "prey bark".

Thanks <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />