I'm really at wits end with this dog!

He'll sit and stay, and he'll go into a down, but he wont go into a down-stay for the life of him.

Any suggestions on teaching a SOLID down-stay?

I sure would appreciate them...


B.B

I like using a square riser.. 3’x3’ or so. Put the dog in a down on the riser and reinforce the down with food rewards and praise. If the dog breaks the down he gets a correction and is placed back on the riser.

There are also some ground rules I use for the handler…..

1) Down means down and I mean it now.
2) The down must be the most reliable command in the toolbox.
3) The dog only gets called out of the down for some other task 1 out of every 100 times.
4) I never free the dog on the first return and 99 out of 100 times I will release the dog from the down at the end of the exercise.

I’m a big stickler with the down. We do a ton of distraction training in the down, everything from wrestling with decoys to throwing toys at the dogs. Consistency in your training and what you demand from your dog are key.

I am a beginner, but I have done a good job with my dog on the down stay.

Do you have Ed's Basic OB DVD? That helped me out a ton!!!!

Just something to keep in mind, I learn't the hard way never teach a sit stay and down stay on the same day,
make sure you get a solid sit stay first, then wait a couple days work on something else, bring in the down stay slowly, as it has a lot more pressure, "down" is a very submissive posture, some dogs are not comfortable placed
and then left, give the command use lots of food, remain standing next to him first couple times, correct immediatley
if he rises, then once you have that solid, step forward and back keep the command down, no eye contact when moving away, do this over a couple of days, step back and forth, a couple of times he must stay in the down postion while you are doing this, do not leave him for long keep holding on to the lead the whole time, you should eventually be able to step over him, if not he is not ready to be left, once you can step back and forth and over him and he stays down slowley start to increase the distance, keep the time away short and build it up slowley, when returning no touching or eye contact, only praise and give eye contact at the end of exercise.This worked especially well for me, my dog was totally nuts over me, and if I so much moved an inch, she
wanted to be under my skin, Such devotion....can be a pain tho, just don't give up keepworking on it. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

what worked for me and this may not be the way to go but when my four yr old was learning the down/stay,once I knew that he learned it I would use the e-collar on him and place him in a down on the sidewalk in front of the house and then go around the side and spy on him. If he went to get up he got a correction with the collar.It only took a couple of times and he is great with it now.I could put him in a down/stay in the back yard,walk around the house for a few and come back and he'd still be there.It might not have been the way to do it,but it worked.P.S.If anyone has any suggestions on that I'd be interested to hear them as I am working with my other guy and if I did that wrong I don't want to make the same mistake twice.JMO Thanks

If it works, don't change it, IMHO -- I think this is a great use of your e-collar, because it's very quick, highly humane, and proofs the dog for reliability when you're out of sight <:-)

Thanks for the reply.I was using that technique in preparation for his upcoming CGC test--which he aced

Well, there ya go, then <:-)

Brian I am personally not a fan of e-collar obedience, but it is entirely your choice, for one our club does not encourage the use of these gadgets they have only been used in real problem dogs the ones we would say have exhausted all other options.Also you need to take the age of the dog into consideration, I saw a young dog totally ruined by the incorrect use of an e-collar, it took months and months to correct this dog, so you need to know how to use one,
also if your reponse time is out you could be doing more harm than good, good luck with what ever you find is going to work best for you.Sometimes a quick fix just brings bigger problems down the line, the dog I mentioned above also had a very mild temperament, turned into a dithering idiot everytime it saw the owner soooooooo sad when this happens.Ignorance can be bliss.

 Quote:

Brian I am personally not a fan of e-collar obedience, but it is entirely your choice, for one our club does not encourage the use of these gadgets they have only been used in real problem dogs the ones we would say have exhausted all other options.Also you need to take the age of the dog into consideration, I saw a young dog totally ruined by the incorrect use of an e-collar, it took months and months to correct this dog, so you need to know how to use one,
also if your reponse time is out you could be doing more harm than good, good luck with what ever you find is going to work best for you.Sometimes a quick fix just brings bigger problems down the line, the dog I mentioned above also had a very mild temperament, turned into a dithering idiot everytime it saw the owner soooooooo sad when this happens.Ignorance can be bliss.

Michelle, not meaning to posture dominantly over you.. but.... you don't seem to know how e-collars work. E-collars, in my opinion are the next best thing since sliced bread. You pratically eliminate handler to dog conflict.. Plus when used properly, you can be very consistent with your corrections ie.. even if you're mad as hell from the dog, you can easily press a button than POP the leash like you want to rip off the dog's head. (works the same for handlers that are too soft)...

I suggest getting the Dvd that Ed sells.. You don't need to get an e-collar.. But I'm sure that once you learn how to properly introduce, practice and use the e-collar;you would agree with me.

Regards,