I'm interested in hearing from the Barfer's any thoughts or concerns about the possible toxins, etc. that might be contained in our beef. I doubt that too many people are able to afford to feed an all organic, pesticide free, raw diet. I'm also interested in hearing from people that may have switched their dogs from "TAP WATER" to some other form of water.

Glenn

I’m not a barfer but logic would tell me that if you don’t eat organic then your dog doesn’t. (Not to be confused with your dog eating better than you, that's okay LOL just not organic). If you don’t drink spring water than your dog doesn’t (which btw is allowed to contain a certain percent of fecal matter where as city water is not.)
"Does the antibiotics and steroids etc in meat produced for human consumption have negative affects on dogs?" <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> Well of course, just like with humans. We would all be vegaterians if we only knew.

Originally posted by Leslie Patterson:
If you don’t drink spring water than your dog doesn’t (which btw is allowed to contain a certain percent of fecal matter where as city water is not.)
Can you point to the reference that allows fecal coliforms to be in spring water? I am familiar with the CFR so a reference number in that or the federal register would suffice. Thank you.

As I understand, many municipalities have significant problems with complicance with the Drinking water standards. I worked in an EPA certified lab and for fun we would run spring and other water through the GCMS (purge and trap) and it came out pretty darned clean for light organics -- which is all you test for with that method).

Nancy is there such a thing as adding a pill to purify tap water? I'm looking into a whole house type filter or purifier. After reading several books they all talk about tap water as being pretty bad for dogs. As far as beef etc; I didn't ever think I would go 100% barf but I now believe that even the cheapest human grade meat is far better than kibble. Unfortunately the cost is 3 to 4 times higher than even the best kibble and that doesn't even include supplements.

Glenn

Glenn,
There is no pill that will "purify" tap water. What the pills do is kill micro-organisms (such as giardia) but do not purify the water. The only way to truly purify water is via distillation or demineralization coupled with filtration. Then you have to be careful to not get it "too pure" as ultra pure water is aggressive, it will eat at metals, leach PCBs from some forms of plastic piping (PVC, CPVC, etc), and will attack the stomach lining. A simple carbon filtration coupled with a water softener will cover what the majority of people need...if you are taking water from a well, then you might want to consider reverse osmosis in addition to carbon filtration.

Tap water contains usually quite a bit of minerals (that's why you see scale build up on hot water heater coils, sometimes see it in bathroom shower heads, etc), and depending on how far you are from an injection point, you can see micro organisms and bacteria. If you ever turn on your tap and smell a faint chlorine smell, then you are either close to an injection point or the city water treatment plant hyperchlorinated the water for some reason (which they're not supposed to do without warning customers and is usually done if there is a problem with cross over or something).

I installed, designed, and serviced water purification systems for a while, from little lab systems in schools to ultrapure systems for Boeing and medical facilities up to a 3Mgpd (that's million gallon per day...water taken from a river as the starting point) water processing plant for a company that makes rocket fuel, so I might know a thing or two about this subject. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

My dog drinks from the outside spigot and savors every drop. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Thanks Mike. It always amazes me to see the various knowledgable people reading this board. I would have never guessed we had our own resident water expert. Probably won't do the water softener but will definately look into the carbon filteration stuff.

Glenn

Originally posted by Nancy Jocoy:
Originally posted by Leslie Patterson:
If you don’t drink spring water than your dog doesn’t (which btw is allowed to contain a certain percent of fecal matter where as city water is not.)
Can you point to the reference that allows fecal coliforms to be in spring water? I am familiar with the CFR so a reference number in that or the federal register would suffice. Thank you.
The reference came from one of my College Profs. I live in Canada and the standards maybe specified to my location.
If the water is bottled and sold in the same state/province or country it is subject to those standards which vary greatly?

I am back from a day of dog training.

I drink tap water and am not too concerned, I do run it through a carbon filter as I don't like the chlorine taste but that is just the one going directly into my fridge but carbon filters are, unfortunatley, a good place to grow microbes. When we lived in Asheville, NC THAT was great water. The entire watershed is protected from development and the reservoir is in a highly gaurded valley. The water is crystal clear and you can see many feet in.

Small world, In my *current* job I have worked with vendors on design specs and have written validation plans for USP /NCCLS Type I Purified ambient water systems for reagent water. The purest water is for the seminconductor industry; even purer than water for injection. You would not believe what goes into the design and testing of these things once they are put into use!. The are fairly big systems that are housed in a computerized water room, not the little point of use ones.

Reviewed numerous municiple reports as we have to track them quarterly (a USP requirement) at nine sites (each with their own water system) to determine what changes are occurring with the feedwater. Although the EPA specifies a certain panel of tests we almost always have to have some addtional testing done as the municipal lab reports are often missing data. Southern California (San Bernardino) was by far the scariest.

Oh for my dogs....I just let water sit overnight before I put it out <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Ok now we have carbon filters "yes" and carbon filters "no" so now what? A good debate on the best way to clean up tap water! I appreciate all the high tech talk and stuff but I'm into simple answers. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> Nancy what does letting the water sit overnight do other than let the heavy ???? settle to the bottom? I cannot do this because I change my dogs water several times a day so this would not work in my situation.

Glenn