Hi folks. I want to know the bottomline of how building drive also builds dominance. It has been flashed in Leerburg's Puppy DVD that playing tug can/will bring dominance issues and the same has been said likewise in this forum.

Why is the increase in drive directly proportional to the increase in dominance? Is this more of a general rule rather than an exceptional possiblity?

I've seen angelic GSD's in shows and Schutz clubs only to find out from someone that I was infact petting a SCHH3 certified dog.

Playing tug and letting the pup win builds confidence, it empowers him. As the pup goes on in training, his skill level in technique will rise, building more confidence. Dominance in a dog is an inherent confidence and add skill and empowering to that and you have a great dog, IMO. Dominance, to me, is not something to be removed, but channeled into work. I learned to appreciate the dominant quality in my GSD. It shows in everything the pup does and how he approaches and learns new things.

My 2 cents.

It's important that Drive and Dominance aren't viewed as synonomous, though drive enhancement does allow for further development of the dominant temperament. Dogs with strong prey drive and dominant temperaments are said to develop the best "fight drive", but enhanced prey drive doesn't create the independant characteristic of dominance. Confidence is "learned", Courage and Dominance are "inherent", but each have different meanings.

definition of Drive (according to http://www.swgdog.org/ )
"Propensity to exhibit a particular pattern of behaviors to particular stimuli. They are triggered to be expressed by that stimulus. Drives can be enhanced or diminished through experience (i.e. training, environment, etc.), but they can never be created or eliminated. Expression of the relationship between the inter-environment of the animal which includes genetics and the external environment which includes experience. Traditionally defined in the working dog literature as an exaggerated, instinctual response to certain stimuli and situations. Drive is most narrowly and clearly defined as a willingness, vigor, or enthusiasm to engage in certain behavior, contexts, or situations."

and, in a nutshell...
Courage is an innate quality of ability to work through perceived or real fearful situations.
Confidence is an environmentally conditioned knowledge of abilities or limitations.

Beautifully expressed, Daryl!

Yes indeed, very well said! I just remembered being advised by dog show (conformation) experts that aside from picking the potentially most beautiful pup, you should pick the one that goes to you first (in most cases) or the one that exhibits early "alpha dog" attitudes among the litter. This means, get the handsome, dominant pup I guess. A dominant dog, according to them, will almost always do good in the show ring: he should in some way exhibit an air of "arrogance": in that he knows he's dominant and is the best and is proud to show it.

It now makes sense to me.

Sorry, I know this thread is ancient, but... increased dominance is the LAST thing I need right now in my teenagery, huge, workinglines pup. He's by nature a bold, pushy guy.. and I am a softspoken, sensitive, slightly disabled handler. Playing the drive building games would not make him feel more dominant in general, or over his handler, would it? (I have not gotten the DVD yet, but am planning to)

Sorry, I know this thread is ancient, but... increased dominance is the LAST thing I need right now in my teenagery, huge, workinglines pup. He's by nature a bold, pushy guy.. and I am a softspoken, sensitive, slightly disabled handler. Playing the drive building games would not make him feel more dominant in general, or over his handler, would it? (I have not gotten the DVD yet, but am planning to)

In my opinion its just the opposite Patti.At least thats how it went with my dog. When you get the DVD follow all the parts of the training no matter what your plans are for your dog. The "Into my arms" cradling and some of the other subtle techniques it shows are more important then you may think. It's not just building drive, it's also focus and teaching him how to work for you in drive.

what if we were to play tug and never let him win the object? is that damaging to his drive? like play tug...let him pull me back a bit but always bring him in and tell him to out the object..?

I'd like to play tug but after seeing the same warning in the video I was hesitant for fear of a "sominant" dog and we dont need another one of those at home...hehe

 Quote: steve strom

In my opinion its just the opposite Patti.At least thats how it went with my dog. When you get the DVD follow all the parts of the training no matter what your plans are for your dog. The "Into my arms" cradling and some of the other subtle techniques it shows are more important then you may think. It's not just building drive, it's also focus and teaching him how to work for you in drive.

Absolutely. Taking your dog into your arms, and especially having him come into your arms using the verbal command (which not all SchH trainers do) is an obedience exercise. You are literally taking a dominant stance over your dog while it holds prey. Depending on the dog, and your relationsip with your dog, this can take some time to develop or it can just happen right away. When it does happen though, it allows the dog to "submit" to you and relax and clear his head while you relax as well and soothe him. Both of you get to catch your breath and then you start again. The end result is a dog that can focus and listen to you while in drive (the dogs most excited state). You literally build his drive, and then sharpen it like a knife to use in training.