Well the header pretty much covers my question, I have been training with a few different nationality's and most of them just train for large amounts. We train for personal use, not just large packages.

Each of our handlers get an ounce of each, except for 3 ounces of marijuana. The training aids are broken down to one, 15 gram aid, then down from there. The smallest is 1 gram. We also conduct training, on occasion, with significantly larger amounts that are maintained by the training section and sued during scheduled training scenarios. When handlers train together they can combine their training aids to equal larger amounts.

DFrost

Mike,

I have mine broken down to 4 aids per scent. 14g, 7g, 5g, and 2g. If I want to work larger amounts I can get up with some of the local departments and we have had large amounts supplied for training.

The first time I ran him on a truck with around 30lbs Marijuana he never indicated to it (training). I think he was confused because the smell was so strong. It's nothing I would do all the time but on occasion I thinks it's a good idea to have some very large finds just to see how the dog reacts.

In the army we train on all the main drugs and we have 10g, 5g, 3g, 2g, 1g on most the drug types and we have 20g bags for MJ

It it nice training with the larger amounts with the other Nato Forces considering my dogs response was nothing like what i imagined. The biggest aid i have trained on so far was around 300g and he didn't give as strong of a response as i would have thought so it was good to see that.

Although we don't consider it actual "training" per se, we have kind of an unwritten agreement among the handlers around here. Any time someone makes a large seizure, we try to get all the dogs we can just to let them have a go at it. We've worked 200 kilos of coke and 56oo pounds of weed. The time window isn't very big, but we try to notify everyone we can. We do the same with explosives. A friend drives for an explosives company. There are times when he'll call me with maybe an hour lead time. I'll contact as many EDD handlers as possible and tell them where to meet. We've been able to run the dogs on hundreds of pounds of different explosives by doing this.

DFrost

David,

Sounds like a great plan. Sadly i haven't found anything big and i am one of the few Narc dogs in this country (i am guessing around 5 narc dogs through out Kosovo) Hopefully that will be something i might be able to do once i get back to the states.

It is a lot better to train with larger amounts of explosives or narcotics than with smaller amounts. Of equal or greater significance to the amount of material used in training are factors such as the amount of scent generated (which is dependent on environmental factors such as temperature and humidity, and surface area of the material), and the quality of the scent signature generated.

The fact is that small amounts of explosives or narcotics do not have all the scent tendrils required to make a K9 an expert in detecting to source. Small amounts of training material have an incomplete scent signature as some of the scent components of such a signature will be below the olfactory threshold of the K9 due to the quantity used and its surface area. The result of this is that the K9 is totally unaware of the complete scent picture of the material, unaware of the less volatile components and then becomes confused when faced with large amounts.

It might be impossible to have frequent opportunities to train with large amounts. This fact highlights the role that chemically-formulated training aids can help to compliment a detector-K9 program, as all the scent tendrils necessary for detection can be formulated into an aid of much smaller dimensions.

 Quote: david adebimpe

The fact is that small amounts of explosives or narcotics do not have all the scent tendrils required to make a K9 an expert in detecting to source. Small amounts of training material have an incomplete scent signature as some of the scent components of such a signature will be below the olfactory threshold of the K9 due to the quantity used and its surface area.

Cocaine is cocaine. Whether it's .25 grams or 2 kilo doesn't make it smell any different. It may be stronger, but the odor of cocaine is cocaine. A tenth of a gram of cocaine isn't any different than a kilo. The odor signature is the same. It may well be harder to find, but it's still cocaine. The problem a dog encounters when confronted with an exceptionally large amount is one of not being able to locate source. The handler generally recognizes the dog is "in odor" but is also confused because the dog can't locate source. Source is located by the dog by first detecting an odor (some refer to this as absolute threshold). The dog then works the weaker odor to its strongest point. What we often refer to as source. When the dog is overwhelmed or has reached the point of saturation, the dog can no longer tell a weaker odor from a stronger odor (which is how a dog locates source). When properly conditioned, the dog has been trained to give the final response at what it determines source (the strongest point of the odor). When the dog can no longer tell a weaker from stronger odor, it's unable to find source, therefore unable to give the final response.

DFrost

David, i'll disagree with you on the fact that "cocaine is cocaine." And this is because i have done a lot of research in this area. A major difference between a small amount of cocaine and a large amount of cocaine, as far as detection is concerned is in the scent signature produced by these amounts. You cannot just call coke, "just coke" when it comes to odor. The odor of coke does not just comprise of cocaine within its scent signature but of a host of other components, and since these components have different vapor pressures they exist within the scent signature in different ratios, depending on the amount and the surface area of the coke used. At .25 grams, more than half of the compounds that make up the scent signature of coke are at present at a level that is below the olfactory threshold of the K9. To the K9 therefore, these odors do not exist, are not recognised by the K9, and will not become part of the odors used for the detection of coke. At 2 kilos however guess what happens: the odors the K9 learnt with a .25g training aid become overwhelming and the olfactory system becomes saturated before the K9 can get to the source of the odor. A K9 finds source by following the scent tendrils that constitute the scent signature of a material, the more scent tendrils available to the K9 during its training, and the more the scent tendrils the K9 recognizes, the quicker and more effective will the K9 be in finding the odor.

I guess we'll just agree to disagree. Scent signature is the total picture the dog gets when learning an odor. Cocaine is a product. That product can be identified through anaylis. A small amount contains the same chemicals as a large amount. Granted, the amount of odor is certainly more with larger amounts, but it's still the same product. You can cut cocaine to 10%, the 10% is still cocaine. It's why we conduct negative test or proof off of diluents, packaging and other associated odors. I've done a little research myself on the subject.

DFrost