I think that's the right term for it. I was reading about the BARF diet on another site, and it specifically mentioned that chicken leg quarters don't have the correct ratio of meat to bones. Right now Kodee is eating mostly Orijen dog food (he gets that every a.m. w/salmon oil and Vit E). In the evenings, I've been alternating between Orijen (about 4 days/wk), and THK Embark w/chicken legs or leg quarters (about 3 days/wk). (He has had ground beef added to THK once so far). He also gets raw eggs w/the shell about 2-3 times per week.

I haven't been able to find chicken necks/turkey necks/backs yet (haven't had much time to look yet). I will hopefully find someone around here soon that I can get them from. In the meantime, should I be giving him wings or something instead of just legs/leg quarters? I'm still kind of apprehensive that I will mess up on his nutrition, which is part of the reason I'm still mostly relying on Orijen. What other raw meat can I "supplement" with for now (til I find necks, etc)?

In that amount, I think any part is fine.

You are only giving it up to the THK directions, right? And THK is balanced. And it's balanced even if all muscle meat is used per the label directions.

I mean, if you are using their guidelines, then the calcium-phosphorous ratio is not a big concern.

If you used THK as a side dish, you would want the main dish (so to speak) to be balanced.

The meat manager at Albertson's orders my turkey necks for me. For some reason I could not find anyone who could get backs and necks until Connie mentioned the restaurant supply company. BINGO...got some ordered. Not sure of cost yet, will find that out when I pick them up.

If you fry chicken, you can always buy whole fryers and cut the backs out, the necks are usually inside with the organ meat. Not the best recommendation, but it is an alternative.

I buy my fryers by the case and I rotate the "cuts" of the chicken, so if Marley gets a leg quarter on Monday, he gets wings and backs on Wednesdays and so on with each dog. Now that I have the deer and buffalo, that goes in as well into the rotation.

Since you are feeding THK and Kibble (why kibble BTW) I think you can get away with ground turkey, pork, and if any stores you know sell rabbit, you can feed that as well.

Chicken leg quarters are just fine.

Some BARFERS (hah! ) are far too OCD about calculating ratios for everything. Seriously, they need to calm down a little. They're going to scare people away with their fanaticism (meant in the nicest way ).

The easiest way to tell if your dog is getting a good ratio of meat and bones is to check his poop. You do not need to perform microsurgery on it, just glance at it :-)

If the poop is loose, then increase bone intake.

If the poop is firm, you're doing great! Relax.

If the dog is pooping yellow powder or gets constipated, then decrease bone intake and increase meat in the diet.

THAT'S IT!

Quality nutrition does not require precise adherence to mathematical formulas (ignore everything the kibble companies say). An animal's body is equipped to extract what it needs from its food, as long as it consumes a species-appropriate diet with reasonable variety.

Chicken legs are far more appropriate nutritionally than orijen (or any other kibble for that matter). Cooking foods will pose a far greater risk of "messing up his nutrition" than feeding a variety of raw meats and bones.

Don't worry so much!

 Quote: Yuko Blum

The easiest way to tell if your dog is getting a good ratio of meat and bones is to check his poop. You do not need to perform microsurgery on it, just glance at it :-)

If the poop is loose, then increase bone intake.

If the poop is firm, you're doing great! Relax.

If the dog is pooping yellow powder or gets constipated, then decrease bone intake and increase meat in the diet.

THAT'S IT!

It's all about the poop, baby. Thanks, Yuko.

Yes, I do monitor piles as well.

I do not worry about what I am throwing in the dish, per say. All of it balances out, and my dogs are all doing great.

 Quote: Carol Boche

Yes, I do monitor piles as well.

I do not worry about what I am throwing in the dish, per say. All of it balances out, and my dogs are all doing great.

Ditto. It's balance over the long term, anyway -- not in each meal. And there is loads of leeway when using THK, because your additions are only a quarter of the total meal. Not only that, but you are only doing it three meals a week.

Yuko is correct; relax.

And ain't it the truth about poops? Within hours of a raw meal, you will know how it "went down."

It's so simple to modify the diet for bones, etc., by what comes out the other end. Even the produce is easily assessed: if you can still differentiate it, then it's too cellulose-y. :>

OK, I guess I will relax - his poops look mah-velous. LOL! Thank you all! I am slowly easing into the raw diet, I think. It took me a while to get up the nerve to give him a raw egg (the first raw thing I gave him - LOL!). Since he didn't croak (laughing at myself :grin it was pretty easy for me to start giving him raw chicken and beef. We're getting there! Your answers have all made me feel much better.

P.S. *Carol: as to why kibble? - I never researched canine nutrition (or even heard of a raw diet) until after I discovered this site. While I'm doing more research on raw, until I get completely comfortable with doing an all-raw diet, I put him on Orijen. It looked like the best kibble I could find. I just recently bought THK - after I get through a bag of it, I'll calculate how much it costs to feed him that. It seems really expensive, but maybe it'll last longer than I think, since it has to be re-hydrated. And Kodee is my baby, so if I can possibly afford it, I may go to just THK, and nix the Orijen. Anyway, don't give up on me. I'm slowly getting persuaded to the "raw side", I think.

Edited by Kori Bigge (12/06/2007 08:57 PM)
Edit reason: P.S. Added

 Quote: Kori Bigge

...I am slowly easing into the raw diet, I think. It took me a while to get up the nerve to give him a raw egg (the first raw thing I gave him - LOL!). Since he didn't croak (laughing at myself :grin it was pretty easy for me to start giving him raw chicken and beef. We're getting there!

The sooner the better! Go Kori!