I had a recall relapse last night. When re-training or re-enforcing the recall on the long line, and the dog ignores the "come" command, is it ok to say "no", stim and reel in the dog? Or is it better to pop the leash and reel in?

Do you have ED's e-collar DVD? He actually demonstrates this with the long line and the e-collar.

The way you describe it Alex, it sounds like either one or the other would do the same thing. Both ways there's a correction. How about going back to the begining and doing some short recalls with a good reward to help reinforce the fun of coming back to you?

Rich, I don't have the DVD anymore. When I bought the collar, I borrowed Ed's DVD from a friend and had it for about a month, then I returned it. I can't remember if Ed gave a pop on the leash, or a stim.

Steve, my dog's recalls are very good in short distance. It's off-leash that begins to be a problem. Normally, off-leash, she comes to me, but last night she ran after a lady walking her dog and didn't listen to me. Nothing happened and I was there within 3-4 seconds, but I don't want that to re-occur. I guess she needs more distraction training as well, but she also needs to know there will be a correction from any distance?

I see what you mean Alex. I think running off is a little different, and probably does need a stronger correction like a little higher stim. I think its more that you are trying to stop something ( running off) then re-train something.

I would only correct the dog if he knew how to respond. For instance, if the dog is leaving you and you call the dog, dog doesn't respond, I wouldn't just stim the dog. I would work the dog on a long line, allow the dog to make a wrong decision, correct with whatever collar you are using and then make sure and give direction with the long line. The dog can be in such drive that he truly cannot "hear" you and the distraction can be so strong that he can loose his head. If the dog doesn't know what to do, the correction is then ABUSE. IMO

Hey Roni, maybe I'm not reading what Alex is saying correctly but where he say's her recalls are very good at a shorter distance I interpreted that to mean she knows how to respond and was choosing to blow him off when she could. I wouldnt try to tell him to abuse her, just enough of a correction to overcome the distraction.

Hi Steve; This is what is so hard about training dogs thru verbal communication instead of us being able to see actually what is going on. In my mind, when a dog respond well close to us, then doesn't when away, the dog is almost always distracted and we need to work more on the understanding of the command and adjust the amount of distance incrementaly. That's why I focus a lot on focus, lolololo.

I wouldnt disagree with you at all Roni. My first thought was go back to the begining on the recall and thats why I replied with that. I think I just looked at Alex's reply and took it as a direct disobedience. Maybe you could say I'm a little over-focused?

Thanks Roni and Steve for your comments.

Roni, I was hoping you'd chime in since I know you have a lot of experience with e-collar training.

Steve is right though as far as what I was meaning to say. I've chatted quite a bit w/Steve via pm and I'm sure any advice he'd give is for the benefit of the dog.

I, myself *think* I was being blown off too. As in, the running off was much more valuable then another toss of the ball, or a piece of hot dog. Since there was no leash on her, how could I correct her? When I got to my dog, I leashed her up and apologized to the lady. It felt REALLY bad about it, since my pet peeve is out of control, off-leash dogs. I didn't correct my dog, since I didn't know if it was too late.

I have worked a lot with her on a 20 ft long line, and then even added another 10-12 ft of rope. Her recall was good up to those 30 ft on a long line. Even w/distractions. I haven't really used the e-collar on her since her recall was pretty solid (recall was only reason I bought e-collar). I guess last night just caught us off-guard? She was a good 50-60 ft away, off-leash and with a level 10 distraction. Since she is good on a shorter recall, what do you suggest I work on? I'm 100% positive she knows what "come" means. 100%.

Thanks