Hi everyone,

I will hopefully be getting a puppy soon, and I was hoping to get some advice. I'm planning on getting a GSD. I want to teach him to eventually do personal protection work, shutzhund, tricks, and I want him to be friendly and cuddly I've never had a dog before, so I'm a total newbie with this stuff.

So here are some questions. If I have to leave the pup alone, should I leave him inside or outside? Should I build a dog run and/or house outside for him? How old is the usual age when they can be left alone for a full working day? How old before you can use an e-collar? That's all I can think of right now.

Any other advice is much appreciated as well. Also, what would you say are "must have" items to get? What are some "nice luxuries"? What are a waste of money?


Thanks so much

First of all, Stephanie, let me welcome you to the forum. This is the best place that you could have come to get advice about becoming a great dog owner.

I was just wondering if you have had very much time in which to search this site. There is a monolith of information at your disposal. I would start with Ed's podcasts that you can watch right here on this site. He will cover many of the questions that you have asked. He will tell you the best videos to order and give advice on some of the best equipment that you can purchase for your new puppy.

Are you aware that a protection dog is rarely cuddly and friendly? Are you aware that schutzhund and protection work are not the same? Are you aware that in order to get a gsd capable of doing either you have to be extremely selective about what breeder you acquire your puppy from. Are you aware that gsd's are highly intelligent and need constant interaction and to have a job to do and that to leave them alone for any period of time is just asking for trouble if you aren't familiar with their temperaments? Are you aware of the liability involved in owning a dog that can and most likely will bite someone without provocation just because they moved wrong or gave the dog the impression that they might be a threat? Are you aware of the fact that when you bring home a puppy that you go several weeks, sometimes months without any sleep? Are you educated on what it takes to crate train a puppy? Have you educated yourself on what to feed your puppy so that he will be healthy? Is the breeder that you are going to get your puppy from experienced with the breed or just someone that had some pups in their backyard? Do you have a gameplan for potty training your puppy? Do you know how you will react the first time he poops on your carpet or tears your shoes to shreds, digs up your yard, destroys your flower bed, etc. Do you know it would not be his fault if he did any of those things? It would be yours? You say you have never owned a dog before and because of this I think you should really know what you are getting into. Dogs are a lot of work and a lot of time. Puppies are even more of both. My advice to you would be to spend as much time as you possibly can on this website educating yourself as to what you are getting yourself into. There isn't a question that you could possibly have that hasn't been asked here and if you find one that hasn't, just ask it. Being a newbie you have ALOT to learn about the job you have in front of you. I am confident that you will be far better educated and will become a much more competent and informed owner if you will take the time to research as much as you can before you ever bring that puppy into your home. The bond that you can have with your new dog will be a joy to you like no other but to not know what you have in store in the days ahead could cause you discouragement and frustration. I commend you for being here and know you will be better for it. Take your time and look around. Many of the questions you have already asked have been answered many, many times on this site. Consider this site as your personal guide to great dog ownership. Good luck with your adventure to come. I look forward to seeing you in the future.

Great article Robbie!

Well ... I have a working line GSD, and one of my favorite pictures is of him sitting on the couch next to my wife cuddling. That said, Robin has given you a good list of things to think about. I would throw in take your time finding a breeder and picking a puppy. You don't need to be in a rush.

I think a crate is a must have for a new puppy.

The podcasts can be found at http://leerburg.com/dogtrainingpodcasts.htm

The ebooks can be found at http://leerburg.com/dogtrainingebooks.htm

The articles can be found at http://leerburg.com/articles.htm

The DVDs can be found at http://leerburg.com/vidolist.htm
I recommend you start with:
http://leerburg.com/120.htm
http://leerburg.com/117.htm
http://leerburg.com/308.htm

In my opinion an entire work day is too long for a new puppy to be in a crate without a potty break. I don't have an outdoor kennel, maybe others can tell you about that. We brought our puppy home at 9 1/2 weeks and for two months my son got up at 2:30 AM and 6:30 AM to take him out.

I ordered an e-collar for my dog when he was 11 months old. Others probably know better than I how young is too young to start with one.

I think you should start by reading Ed's articles and listen to his podcasts. He also has streaming videos. Then start on the DVDs.

Good luck to you!

Welcome to the forum Stephanie! This is the place to be if you are thinking about getting a GSD. There are alot of knowledgeable people on this forum that can help you out with any questions or problems you may have. Definately do your homework first before getting the pup (you could probably spend a few monthes just reading the information on this website alone). Please share pictures when you do get a puppy

My best advice is prepare, and prepare early. I won't address any protection work materials because that is beyond what I train for with my dogs.

Get some good books. Then get some great dvds. I highly suggest Ed's videos. As far as books there are alot to pick from. I suggest a basic dog book to start with (I like dogs for dummies), followed up by a basic training book (I like Monks of new Skete), followed up by a more advanced training book, a dog philosophy book (like dog whisperer) and so on. I've been into dogs for about 15 years now and my lists of books on Amazon keep getting longer... not shorter.

Second is to start looking for a good vet.

Third is start to look at your own life and see what changes will need to happen to accomodate a dog. In my house it means I break up my sleeping into two chunks since I work late. It also means I have taken up biking and walking more so than the average person. It also means I invested in a better vaccume cleaner. Think about a 24 hr schedule as it is now and then add a puppy. Then look at your week schedule as it is now and add a puppy. Ask yourself if you really have the time.

Fourth: Find a club to work with on training. This is important since you've never trained a dog before. I would actually start attending BEFORE you get the dog.

I'm sure there are somethings I'm forgetting but Finally start making a list of items you will need.

High on my list of musts
Dishes (I have 4 per dog, all steel pans)
a crate
a collar
a leash
a good brush ( I love zoom groom, furminator, coat rakes)
some kind of ID for your dog. (I prefer microchips/some prefer tattoos or tags.)
Some kind of food plan (this is a big topic)
a good vet


Very likely a good idea items:
Toys
a doggie first aide kit
Chews
training treats
a good dog shampoo
a spare leash
a drag leash
a training collar (either chain or prong)
running/walking shoes
earplugs for crate training

As far as your questions:
If I have to leave the pup alone, should I leave him inside or outside? Should I build a dog run and/or house outside for him?

I don't know where you live, what the temps, the wildlife, or the people are like. I live in the middle of nowhere now in a fairly safe neighborhood with my backyard with a 6 foot chainlink fence. I personally leave one of my dogs in a run in the backyard on a concrete patio inside of this fenced area. My other smaller dogs stay in runs inside my heated carless garage while I work.
That said I have lived in neighborhoods where I would never dream of leaving a dog of any kind outdoors alone for any length of time. This requires a judgement call, my personal thought is judge on the side of the safety of your dog. People do steal and harm dogs and these cowards tend to do so while you're away. Puppies and other small dogs are a big target for this but adult dogs are not immune from this either.

How old is the usual age when they can be left alone for a full working day?
This depends on the dog and how you keep it while you are at work.

How old before you can use an e-collar?
This is a judgement call. I personally don't get out an e collar until I'm ready for offlead work which for my dogs vary with each and every one by months and even years.

Welcome to the board! I look forward to seeing your new pup.

Thanks for the warm welcome and the advice

I've taken a look around the site before joining the forum, I've read a lot of the articles and listened to some podcasts, etc... The videos look good also, but I've not ordered any yet.

Some responses to the questions asked by RobbinMann. Why are protection dogs not cuddly and friendly? I was under the impression that they only were aggressive when told to be, but in general were good companions. As I understand it, schutzhund is a sport involving obedience, tracking, and protection work. How do I know what breeder to choose? There are many in my area that all seem to breed good pups. The GSD's intelligence is what attracts me most to the breed. I was under the impression though, that as an adult, a GSD can be left alone during the day if they are given a lot of attention, exercise, and training after work. I thought protection training reduces the chance of a dog biting without being told to because it has been trained well. While I've never trained a pup, I've read up on it, and I do understand it will be hard work.

How's that? Let me know. Thanks.

Thanks for the advice Melissa. A question: You mention I should find a club to train with. I thought group training wasn't a good idea for basic obedience. Shouldn't I get the pup to understand and follow basic commands before finding a club?

My neighborhood is pretty danger free and I have fenced back yard. I live near Toronto, so it's very warm in summer and very cold in winter. I was thinking of building a chain link fenced dog run, with concrete pad and cover for the dog, so that someone wouldn't be able to let him out of the yard accidentally when the go into the backyard. But my husband thinks that its overkill and he would be fine in the regular fenced yard. Thoughts?


Thanks so much

 Quote:

Some responses to the questions asked by RobbinMann. Why are protection dogs not cuddly and friendly? I was under the impression that they only were aggressive when told to be, but in general were good companions.

Stephanie, let me rephrase this comment. As a rule, most GSD's are very affectionate and loving towards their immediate pack. However, depending on the type of gsd you buy, you might not get cuddly and friendly, at all. There are some working lines that just don't have the temperament of a sweet and cuddly dog. They are all business and work driven. There is no doubt that if you buy a dog from showlines that he/she will be cuddly and friendly, at least most I have met are. However, buying a showline does not guaranty that you will end up with a dog that has the fortitude and temperament to be trained in protection. Believe me, everyone wants a dog that can be a jekyl and hyde on cue but they are far and few between. The ones that do exist are being bred and shown for lots of $$! So, the statment that protection dogs aren't cuddly may be a tad bit extreme but from your post and listening to what you want I think that you are overshooting what you might really be looking for in a companion dog.

 Quote:

As I understand it, schutzhund is a sport involving obedience, tracking, and protection work.

This is correct. However, the protection work in Schutzhund does not mean the protection work that a dog trained to bite on command would be doing. Many times the dogs will only cue onto the sleeve/equipment. In a real situation, the dog most likely wouldn't know what to do.

 Quote:

How do I know what breeder to choose?

Ahh, the $65.00 question! Lots of research! Getting recommendations from people here on the forum would be a good start. There are also many things that you need to ask a breeder.

1) How far back does the line go w/o having hip issues.
2) What are you rights as far as breeding your dog. Alot of breeders will not allow you to breed so that they can keep control of their line.
3)What kind of temperament do the pups have. This is best to know before you pick a pup. The breeder, if they are any good, will help you pick a pup that has a temperament that will match your needs and family situation. An alpha pup might be the best for protection but also the least easy to train and possibly might need an experienced and firm hand to keep control of. While a more submissive pup might be great with family, a good watch dog, great for sport and companionship.
4)What was the bitch fed, do they vaccinate their pups before selling? Making sure they have a health guarantee and free of worms.

 Quote:

There are many in my area that all seem to breed good pups. The GSD's intelligence is what attracts me most to the breed. I was under the impression though, that as an adult, a GSD can be left alone during the day if they are given a lot of attention, exercise, and training after work.

Again, this is relative to the temperament of the dog you choose. Beside the fact that we aren't talking about an adult dog here, we are talking about a pup. Pups can not be left for long periods of time at all. You might want to consider a dog about a year old if this is something you anticipate having to do on a regular basis. While all dogs need exercise, attention and training, an older dog with proper set up can be left alone while you are at work, although if you are going to leave him outside I would make sure to lock the kennel. Many nice gsd's have been taken from back yards.

 Quote:

I thought protection training reduces the chance of a dog biting without being told to because it has been trained well. While I've never trained a pup, I've read up on it, and I do understand it will be hard work.

In theory, this is a very nice assumption but again, not a guaranty. Any dog, trained to protect or not has the potential to bite at any given time and dogs that are trained to do so have even less fear about actually doing it. There are some that are just itching for the opportunity to bite. This again has to do with breeding. I don't want to paint a scary picture for you here but I do think that the best thing you can do is to make sure to thoroghly investigate the breeder and the lines of the dogs in question. Check with the BBB on the breeder, ask for the phone numbers of other people they have sold dogs to. Find out about the different dogs temperaments and how it was to train them. It will also give you a feel for what the dogs are capable of accomplishing.

You made a comment in your next thread that you live in a pretty safe neighborhood so again I ask why you feel that a protection dog is what you are looking for. Do you feel that your personal safety is at risk? Alot of people think they want a protection dog but in fact just want a dog that can scare the bejeezus out of someone if they need to. Most GSD's are naturally good watch dogs. You can also train them to bark on command to put forth alot of bravado. This usually takes care of things rather quickly. Most won't risk messing with a dog of this type.

So, please don't let me throw the doom and gloom forecast at you. Just let me encourage you to be wise and patient. When you believe you really understand the dynamics of just exactly what it is you want out of a dog, then go for it! Ask lots of questions and don't be afraid to argue with a breeder if something doesn't feel quite right to you. Everyone has a different opinion on what makes up a well bred gsd. Trust me, I was never so confused and frustrated until I started finding out all the different lines and opinions that different breeders had. There is a joke in the breeding world that states, "The only thing two breeders agree on is that the third breeder is doing it wrong"

 Quote: Stephanie Wilson

Thanks for the advice Melissa. A question: You mention I should find a club to train with. I thought group training wasn't a good idea for basic obedience. Shouldn't I get the pup to understand and follow basic commands before finding a club?

My neighborhood is pretty danger free and I have fenced back yard. I live near Toronto, so it's very warm in summer and very cold in winter. I was thinking of building a chain link fenced dog run, with concrete pad and cover for the dog, so that someone wouldn't be able to let him out of the yard accidentally when the go into the backyard. But my husband thinks that its overkill and he would be fine in the regular fenced yard. Thoughts?

The main purpose of a club is to help you learn how to train and later to help you with distractions and it is great to network for ideas and solutions for problems you've never thought of before. Trust me your dog will raise questions for you eventually that the books likely wont address or will address wrong. You'll be able to get a feel for how your dog should be acting at various stages of learning and tricks to get the results you want. Nothing beats seeing it all in action.

As far as the fence. I personally would get a run if you prize your lawn or shrubs and even your fence. It also makes it handy to have a place to keep your dog to keep them from destroying the outside of your house. My lab once attempted to make her own doggie door through the siding.