Quick question.

When is it good to start using an ecollar for training a puppy, is it ever?
Note: pup is 13 weeks old.
thanks,
NB

what is there to TRAIN????????
If you cant wait to let the baby turn into a child go for funtracks,find food be happy.
Jutta

Thanks for info & links! I thought its to early for ecollar, just needed confirmation.
Re:"funtracks" what is that?
Ps, if you want the reason why i was considering the ecollar at such a young age, see my other posts. He is not an ordinary puppy, he is the devil!!!

 Quote:

Originally posted by Nick Barounis:
He is not an ordinary puppy, he is the devil!!!

Nick,

GSD puppies are supposed to be devils! And considering that your puppy is out of W. German show lines, I would count my blessings <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> .

I've raised 2 puppies, and as far as I am concerned, they also could be my 'devil dogs'. The ONLY way I found I could easily live with them (and love them) was by giving them serious amounts of AGE APPROPRIATE exercise.

By this, I don't mean forced marches up the Grand Canyon, or dragging them on a leash while I ride a bike for miles. Or sticking them on a treadmill while I go watch tv.

The GOAL of my exercise program, was to have a dog that would come in the house, look for it's bed/crate, and then sleep until supper. AND I knew I did the best job when the good behavior would continue thru the next day!

I would plan my exercise/socialization experiences for my pups for at least every other day for AT LEAST the first year I have the pup. And if I did not stay on this schedule, and the 'devil dog' came back, than it was MY FAULT, not my pups. The normal energy level of an active intelligent WORKING dog puppy is immense. And when I took on the puppy I felt I took on the responsiblity of this same mental and physical energy.

So, I had my schedule arranged (just like for a human child with scouts, ballet, sports, band, karate, carpooling, school, etc) and ON MY CALENDAR. I signed up my dog for obedience classes. Then onto agility classes. If I had a puppy kindergarden I'd have joined that, but instead I have TONS of friends with dogs!!! And I would call them up, go to their homes and the dogs would play!!!! Or we'd meet in a local park and go for an hours long romp in the woods. Or I'd go to Main St USA to ask people to 'pet my dog'. And walk around town with all the scary new sights/sounds/noises etc. This is easy to put into your regular day cause when you are done you just put your dog in the car and finish your normal shopping.

Once again, NO FORCED EXERCISE, you need to know your dog and keep and eye on them. BUT this was how I knew I did my 'job' to tire my girls out. If on the ride home, my dogs are crashed in their seats. And they have to wake up when I pull into the driveway. And when I get to the house they go inside, greet the cats, and then disappear until supper cause they are napping (a good dog is a sleeping dog). And later that night they sleep thru with no problems! Like I said, this good behavior will continue the next day IF you did it properly.

Renee Felknor, "GSD puppies are supposed to be devils! And considering that your puppy is out of W. German show lines, I would count my blessings."
What do you mean by this, are w. germ gsd show lines known as prob children??? i was realy not aware. I rushed & got him, i was tired of waiting for a "german" litter & when one became available in my general area i jumped at it.

Jenn Kavanaugh, I do most of the things you say, at first it would tire him out & he would sleep upon returning home. Now though i have to do things longer & more...intense you could say & he still has energy to burn upon returning home. if not he recuperates in a few hrs.

Oh lord! i did not realy know what i was getting into when i got this pup. i have no pup experience before him, just a lot of adult dog emperience/training. that is why all my questions, had it been a adult dog with the same issues i would have been able to deal with it in an appropriate & more confidant way but with a pup im always second guessing my actions because im afraid of being to hard or too leanent on him & messing up the dogs drive or creating a out of control monster.

either way im stuck, as i love him :rolleyes: & am commited to him till he or i die. im not the type of person to get rid of a dog for any reason, problems,profit...
thanks all for the responces.
Nb

Nick you dont have to worry about a crazy monster out of that breeding. He is show lines and it shows neither parents are titled. This is something you must relize. I would recommend not giving this pup any negative experiences at all if you want a possibility of him doing schutzhund.
There was a show breeding a while back that a friend of mine took the most dominant, crazy, drivy pup of the litter. He wanted a dog for schutzhund and was pursuaded into getting this dog as the breeder said it would work well....I was not as close friends at the time to advise him otherwise. Anyways after a few months the dog turned into his real self and was a nervy, submissive, coward with 0 prey drive, food drive etc. This dog was brought up properly so that was not the issue. Just comes down to genetics. I also know the brother of this dog and he is similar but a little bit better temperment...he is good for a pet though....bad hips though.
You said you are going to keep him SO I would say again, no negative experiences at all, all motivational (as it should be with any pup), build his drive and keep it going, if he thinks he is a tough guy then let him and dont put him in a spot where his confidence will be destroyed ie older dog putting him in his place, etc.
If you want a dog that will run around a ring and look pretty then get show but if you want a dog for sport then get working. If you want a pet then I would say pet quality working.
I know you may not like what I say but if you want a chance with this dog for anything then I suggest you do what I said. As for any correction tool, e-collar, prong, etc...I would not do until after 12 months at least and the dog absolutly knowing the command.

 Quote:

Originally posted by Patrick Hennigan:
Nick you dont have to worry about a crazy monster out of that breeding. ...

You said you are going to keep him SO I would say again, no negative experiences at all, all motivational (as it should be with any pup), build his drive and keep it going, if he thinks he is a tough guy then let him and dont put him in a spot where his confidence will be destroyed...

Nick,
This is the best advice on the subject I've heard so far... Watch your PMs, I will try to explain in detail what the above paragraph means in practice, since I've had a little experience with both working and show lines. Meanwhile, forget about the alpha roll, slapping your pup on the snout when he goes for a ball, and if you don't want him to sit on your head, keep it off the floor <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> .

My showline dog did the same thing. She went from GSD to lab as she grew up. I also ended up with a showline dog because I didn't know about any working lines in my area. Hopefully your dog will at least be healthier <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> and have better nerves (Auster is constantly barking, gets old real quick).