I've listened to the podcast & read articles on how to train with markers. I'm needing some extra details regarding how to implement these ideas.

While my 9-wk puppy & I are still working on marking the words yes, I'm interested in knowing what would be the next step or two, so that when my puppy consistently looks at me with that "what now", I'll have an answer.

Your next step (once you have established your marker word) is to start training.

There are two ways to do this; you can wait for a desired behavior that the pup does on its own (like when he looks you in the eyes) and mark and reward, or you can lure the pup into a particular position, and mark and reward.

Pick something you want to start on, and give it a shot. 'Sit' is a good one. You can lure the pup into a sit position by holding a treat in front of him, and then raising your hand slightly over his head. This should get him in the sit position. When his bum hits the floor, say 'yes!' and give him the treat. Don't worry about naming the command yet.

Try this for a few repetitions and take a break and try again a little later. You want to keep your training sessions very short (like 5 minutes) at this age.

Once he's consistantly sitting w/ the lure, you can lure and say 'sit' at the same time. You can probably lure without the treat (ie just hand motion) at this point. Mark and reward and phase out the lure (hand motion) over a couple of short sessions.

Once he's got it down, start to vary where you have him perform the command. You want 'sit' to mean 'plop your butt on the ground wherever I tell you', not just 'plop your butt on the ground in the kitchen'.

 Quote: roni hoff

Lynne;
You must say the word before the lure. The dog will always default to body language and will not process the word. The sequence is "word,pause 1 sec, lure,pause until the finish of the task, mark, pause, reward.
Ann Braue, amazing agility person says "don't name it til ya love it". So no hurry to put word in until the task is exactly as you like (love)it.
Happy Training,
Roni

Roni, thanks for that clarification!

That is good clarification, I have always said the word at the same time as the signal or lure rather than before it.
I am going to start trying it first and see what the difference in response is.

I do wait until we really have the behavior down before naming it, I find hand or body signals to be so much more effective for my dogs.

I also find that I can get a calmer more focused response when my voice is used minimally with my crazy husky. Eye contact and hand signals really make him pay attention to what I want him to do.

but what's the best strategy if you wait until the pup offers you a smorgasboard of behaviors after you've loaded the mark?

i personally have found (so far), that a kind of combination of adding a command (ie, platz), with the marker (platz, yes!, treat), and working on only pairing one command for the training sessions has worked "ok" with Ike. especially if i devote pairing the command+marker+treat for a few days at a time, ie, i don't ask for any other behavior while working on one, and ignoring any other behaviors.

what i have been doing: word, wait for behavior (lure if necessary), mark, treat. trying to bridge from marker to treat by using "good sit" to extend time between marker and treat. is that how i should be doing it??

FWIW, Ike is not quite 6 mo old, have been loading mark, etc since he was 12 wks old when i got him.

great thread!

i feel like i'm missing something here, but it does seem to lock the behavior to the command. i'm definitely still in the learning phase myself; any thoughts will be appreciated, and if mine help anyone....well--THAT'LL be a miracle

"what i have been doing: word, wait for behavior (lure if necessary), mark, treat. trying to bridge from marker to treat by using "good sit" to extend time between marker and treat. is that how i should be doing it??"

I don't introduce duration until I have 100% response without it.

eta: Also, the intermediate bridge is generally an all-purpose sound, I think, as opposed to "good sit". For example, a g-g-g-g-g-g sound can be used to bridge the interval and encourage duration for any command.
(end of e.t.a.)

You mentioned offering behaviors. I find that very heartening: Here is a thinking dog, who not only fully understands that he wants that marker, but is working through the ways he has seen to get it!

I do what you do: I ignore offered behaviors other than the one we are working on.

Sometimes it's funny! I have one who will often run through every doggy push-up he knows, even while he is waiting ten feet away and another dog is "at bat." He never seems to give up hoping that once, just once, I'll somehow see that unasked-for "sit" or "down" and mark it and throw a reward over there. He will even "sit" extra hard, with a big thump. I guess that's so I will feel the floor-vibrations.

Do you have any little video clips? They are so great for offering suggestions, and also for beginners to see markers in action.







Edited by Connie Sutherland (01/18/2010 07:24 PM)
Edit reason: eta in mid-post

 Quote: bev thibault

I've listened to the podcast & read articles on how to train with markers. I'm needing some extra details regarding how to implement these ideas.

While my 9-wk puppy & I are still working on marking the words yes, I'm interested in knowing what would be the next step or two, so that when my puppy consistently looks at me with that "what now", I'll have an answer.

Have you got Ed's DVD The Power of Training Dogs with Markers? It's so good - it really shows all the different steps of marker training! It's even funny - Cindy trains Ed with markers!

Hi Bev,

In reading the other thread about your pup's illnesses I suggest that your time would be better spent practicing your marker timing rather than making demands on a sick infant puppy.

Are you using a clicker or a verbal mark?

I made myself practice with a tennis ball and clicker for 3 days before I ever started with my dog. I did this by throwing the ball in the air and marking the apex of the throw, marking when I could see the writing on the ball, etc. This helped me realize how fast the "snapshot" I wanted to capture flashes by, and I felt really comfortable with the tool before I ever experimented with my dog.

Great suggestion! Shall do - and rest assured, we haven't been doing any training the past four days, when his scratching became continuous. I am using the verbal method.

I just like having the knowledge ready before I need it.

B