I was asked to come and help pick out a puppy. We viisted this puppy owner. And I was impressed at how socailized, bright and smart these puppies were. They could come and follow the lady around like little ducks, at 8 weeks old.

My friend started noticing this big female puppy that seemed to wale the crap out of some of its mates. Others would meet her in play.

Well my assoicate decided on the big female, saying that she wants a dog thats stronger then she is emotionally and in sprit.

I took her to the side and asked her are sure thats what you want? A dog like that could start running your house. She stated as long the dog did what she asked she didn't see any problem.

Was I wrong??

She put a deposit on a puppy and we left to think about this. On the way home we discussed the mean female puppy more, and some options. All the puppies were cute.

I suggested the quiter and less rambucous female, and Ingrid told me that puppy reminds her of herself and she didn't like that. My friend is timid and sorta shy, she thinks that a big bad bitch might give her the courage to do more.

We talked about Ob training and control work, what it could cost and how it would be continuous. I mentioned several Pro trainers gave her a book and some numbers to call. Suggested Ed Puppy OB tape.

She is still leaning toward the deominant female.

How do you explain that you are not what your dog is? He/She is what you make it. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Hi Don,your friend sounds like a prime candidate for a dog adoption or shelter down the road.Why not show her one of your or someone elses adult alpha dogs in action?Kinda like the "scared straight" thing they do in prisons for juveniles,put the dog in full drive then let her take over the reins and it shouldn't take long for her to realize that she can't handle a 44 magnum,but a 22 cal. with less kick and controlled placement can be just as deadly.I would stress to her that what she lacks as a pack leader is exactly what a really dominate dog would take advantage of and if not controlled could easily become a danger to the public and herself.

Don , please beg your friend to heed the great post by Ed Correll!!!

Rising to the challenge sounds like a great goal, but what really happens is that the owner is always filled with self doubt, because they are taking on a new role and they aren't sure what to do. It's normal when you try something new, only the dog sees you floundering and decides to take over. Once that happens it goes downhill from there.

If she wants to increase her own confinence get a dog that needs her to take care of it and be alpha. A dog from a rescue that is a little on the shy side is great for this. Then there won't be any mistaking what role each should take, and they will both be more confident because of it. I used to work for a vet near a retirement community and it was great to see some of these older people get their confidence back after a traumatic event (loss of a loved one, etc.) because their dog needed a leader. They rose to the task with their dog's help, not in an effort to be bigger or badder than the dog.

Given time, the puppy that is now acertive will become an adult that will literally chew her up and may not spit her out.

Don,
You gave good advice. Unfortunately, people often don't heed good advice.

If you have the ability to show her what a dominant dog is like as an adult, maybe she'd think twice about it. Examples in the flesh tend to convince the under experienced, at least in regards to dogs.

So I am not talking down to her like she said. She asked me if I thought I'm that much more of a stronger person then she is. Some people take this personal.

I have let her do OB with my dogs she wants a dog that demand that kind of respect. But she forgets that when I go to my Jeep, Matt literally tows her with him, (she looks like a kite). Matt thinks its time to load up.

She couldn't control him if they were by themself and he really wanted to do something.

He does obey her and will track or work for her, if I'm around or hiding from them. But I would not leave them alone he would figure out whos boss real quick and she would let him. Thinking as long as he does what I say it doesn't matter.

Not realizing that Obeying won't last long once the dog found out hes Alpha. The dog must do what you want more then it wants to do what it wants.

She held the leash and she has seen some bite work and think she can handle it. But like you said it different when she has to work a greener dog, meaner dog or take the bite.

She does think that my male and female are too big for her, that is why she wants a female GSD.
We looked shelters and she couldn't find a GSD or dog that she liked.

Prior to this we have even gone to the pro trainers/breeders for the ready made Protection dog. But she read something that these dogs may bite their new owner because the bond may not be strong enough in the begining.

Some people think this is all built in, I asked her do you think that the dog bonding and training happens overnight.

She made a point that the larger bitch seems to have what it take whereas the smaller one may not. She wants a pet, companion and protector. She denies that she wants an Icon or ego boost from the dog. She is sold on the dominat female.

She is planning on a Pro trainer so thats a good start. I can hear it now Look what you got be into, shes chewing up everything. There will be lots of time that the Trainer will not be there, likving arrangements must be set.

I forgot to mention Ingrid is my bosses, boss on my 2nd job. What the saying up s&^! creek without a paddle!!!

So I can't say I told you so.

I feel for you, Don <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> Sounds like you're between a rock and a hard case. It's too bad, too. You've done what you think is right, and it seems the board is behind you (as am I). This woman doesn't have a clue what she's setting herself and the dog up for.

I'm no expert, for sure, BUT I am a person who is WELL aware of his limitations.

I wish you, her, and most importantly the dog the best of luck. They're going to need it.

Don,
Yikes,,this is a real scary situation and you have done your best. Wish she could spend an hour with my 9 month old GSD,,she would DEFINITELY change her mind pretty quick.
Good luck!! or should I say Good Luck to her!! I figure anywhere from 8 months - 18 months we'll be seeing this dog's picture on a shelter web page.

Unfortunately, many people unconciously see their dogs as an expression of themselves - or how they would like people to perceive them. Sounds like this lady does not like her own self image and wants something big adn tough to feel more secure.

Is the breeder aware of the puppy's personality and the lady's inexperience? Some breeders just sell to whoever has the cash - first come, first choice, rather than deciding which puppy should suit the personality of the puppy and its suitablity to the environment, the buyer's needs and expereicne. Some people just want a puppy for the wrong reason, and in the long run, the puppy is the one who suffers. Hopefully, if the lady gets in over her head you can help her either rehome the dog or get her set back onto a path wehre she can suceed.

Good luck!!!