I know that some members wanted the other thread closed and I too thought it had started out inadvertently offensive in its comparisons, but then the topic was cut short too.

So .....

Betty Landercasp said:
QUOTE: It's just sometimes I get the feeling that people think vets "make up" diseases for their own profit -- well, that's just not so. END QUOTE

and Aimee Pochron said:
QUOTE: I think that is partially true. There are a lot of good vets or MD's and there are also a lot of under-eduacted ones. Then there are a lot of people looking for a cheap, quick fix for their pets or humans, a lot believe that a pill will cure anything and then they're mad when it doesn't work after refusing any type of work up. I can totally see how it becomes a vicous circle mixing educated/under-educated professionals and educated/uneducated clientele. I also think that some professionals should know better, but I also think people need to take some responsiblity and become involved. Plus medical science is rarely black and white. Finances is a hard thing to control and does have to factor in there some where with the unexpected illnesses.

I guess my point is that the people seeking medical services need to be more active or at least more realistic. Maybe comparable or not, but it is like those that own a dog and allow unruley behavior and then expect someone to come in and make the dog behave after a 6 week class and they only work the dog during class. People can be quick to blame professionals when they do minimal or nothing. END QUOTE

Aimee's point about a vicious circle also kind of applies to my desire that my vet have the best equipment available right there .... but I seldom give a thought to what it takes to pay for it.

I know that's a whole other vicious circle, but it's one I sure can see the inherent evils in.

Personally I feel a little bad for most vets coming out of schools today. Not only do they have an epic student loan debt at the start of their career but if they hope to be a successful vet often times they have to sell part of them selves that used to be for "helping animals" to the marketing portion of the business. I had a reality check myself at work when a very tenured vet referred to a litter of boxer puppies as great potential revenue unrealized.

When you combine with that the knowledge level of the average pet owner combined with the idea that owners expect a magic wand to cure their dogs of all their ills but only up to a certain dollar amount. It's gotta be infuriating.

Then on the back side of that how little feedback we supply vets. We have a litany of examples where the vet got it wrong in a way that would have spelled disaster if someone didn't seek a second opinion. How many of us went back to vet #1 and explained to them how wrong they were? I know its a little odd to provide a vet with feedback but they are human, they do make assumptions and mistakes which don't exactly get the peer review of human medical errors.

 Quote: Connie Sutherland

Aimee's point about a vicious circle also kind of applies to my desire that my vet have the best equipment available right there .... but I seldom give a thought to what it takes to pay for it.

I know that's a whole other vicious circle, but it's one I sure can see the inherent evils in.

I agree equipment. I dislike going from here to there for this and that. The good side is there are different opinions, the bad side continuity. The more I think on this one there are a lot more pro's and con's that weigh in...most def. another vicious circle situation.

 Quote: Melissa Thom

Then on the back side of that how little feedback we supply vets. We have a litany of examples where the vet got it wrong in a way that would have spelled disaster if someone didn't seek a second opinion. How many of us went back to vet #1 and explained to them how wrong they were? I know its a little odd to provide a vet with feedback but they are human, they do make assumptions and mistakes which don't exactly get the peer review of human medical errors.

Very good points, somthing I've not put much thought into!

I own my own business..... I'm in it for the money.

 Quote: Michael_Wise

I'm in it for the money.

double !

This is a topic near and dear to my heart. I think MOST Vets truly love and care about animals - period. However, I think they are undereducated about important issues like nutrition and they are over-influenced by pharmaceutical companies and pharma reps. My vet office still displays and recommends Hills Science Diet - crap in my opinion. Having said that, there are three vets in the practice I go to who have so many years of experience that I have to trust their opinions in most cases. But not all - when one tells me to stick with an established trust food like IAMS or Purina I turn my ears off.

As for vaccines, I think people need to educate themselves and guard their beloved dogs against over-vaccination. I lost my last shepherd to liver failure four years ago. His troubles started right after he had a set of shots in 2003 which included lepto. A few days later I took him in for teeth cleaning and his preop blood work showed liver enzymes off the charts. They said he had cholangic hep, which is basically hep of undetermined causes. He survived, but three years later his liver failed again. I am convinced it was the lepto shot. Shortly after he got sick the first time it was taken out of the multi-way shots and there was a lot of chatter about it being a high-risk, low effectiveness shot. VEt schools started going to 3 year protocols recommendations instead of yearly. I feel like I got caught in the crack and it cost my dog several years of his life.

Excellent post Kathy. I think that you are right that most Vets truly love animals.
I also think there are two schools of thought or two different frames of mind when it comes to the philosophy of care and wellness in both the human medical field as well as in the animal vet field.
One is that of convention and the other is more holistic.
Both serve their purpose, but it seems that people either fall into either of those categories or in between and call themselves integrative practitioners.

 Quote:

As for vaccines, I think people need to educate themselves and guard their beloved dogs against over-vaccination

Very well said. It is incumbent upon us to do the research and decide what is best for our animals, just as I would do for myself.
I don't just blindly trust in any type of physician any longer because of some negative experiences. I do the exact same for my pets.
Education ends up being the best defense in the long run.

It seems that over time we are seeing more and more attention being given to how long and how effective vaccines are.
I can only hope for a time when we can see a day when there can be a certainty to knowing how long our animals are protected for. Also for titers to be allowed to be shown as proof of what our pets antibodies are, so that the health of our pets will be paramount, that they be given only when the dogs immunity is in need. (rabies)

Just curious, does anyone know, are there any vets that specialize in immunity like there is in the human field of medicine? Like an infectious disease specialist?


Kathy, I am sorry for your loss of your last GSD.




Edited by Joyce Salazar (09/19/2010 06:30 PM)
Edit reason: spelling

Joyce, that loss was 4 l/2 years ago and I swear it is almost as fresh today as it was then. Some dogs are so special.....

But just sometimes, when I look at Ruby, I almost see Phinney. But they are SO different from each other :}}

He was like a very old, meek soul born into a puppy body and she is a total young romping hellion acting just like a puppy every minute of her little young life!