Brad Higgs wrote 03/04/2011 12:31 AM Teaching "Back" #320066 - 03/04/2011 12:31 AM
Brad Higgs Webboard User Reg: 06-13-2010 Posts: 511 Loc: Western Australia Offline	Trying to teach my girl to back up and not having much luck. Is it better to start teaching this from in front of the dog or in the heel position? I've tried sort of both but instead of moving back she sort of sits and folds herself up, if she does take a step back I mark it but she just doesn't seem to be getting it. Any tips would be greatly appreciated!
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Cassie Timm wrote 03/04/2011 06:36 AM Re: Teaching "Back" [Re: Brad Higgs ] #320075 - 03/04/2011 06:36 AM
Cassie Timm Webboard User Reg: 01-23-2011 Posts: 85 Loc: Offline	I taught my dog to back up in the heel position. From the heel postion you need to make a sandwich with the dog. The dog needs to be in the middle of you and the wall. You may need to step into the dog to make the dog start to back up. The first step she does mark and treat.
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Mara Jessup wrote 03/04/2011 06:53 AM Re: Teaching "Back" [Re: Brad Higgs ] #320076 - 03/04/2011 06:53 AM
Mara Jessup Webboard User Reg: 12-28-2005 Posts: 2316 Loc: Offline	I taught my dog "back" with a flight of stairs behind her - kinda hard to sit down when there's a step in the way But a little more seriously, what are you teaching the command for? Performance? just fun? a certain trick? That would probably influence me a bit in how I taught it. Also, do you have a solid heel on her? With good turns and changes of pace? If you teach it in conjunction with "heel" but want it for situations outside of heeling you're going to have to wean her off the heel after you train it. I might put something slightly raised/different texture behind her to back up onto so she gets the idea that she needs to be aware of what is happening with her back feet. K-9 Knitter
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Barbara Schuler wrote 03/04/2011 07:04 AM Re: Teaching "Back" [Re: Mara Jessup ] #320079 - 03/04/2011 07:04 AM
Barbara Schuler Webboard User Reg: 01-15-2009 Posts: 5090 Loc: Lanexa Virginia Offline	I've seen Mara's dogs back up a flight of stairs and it is amazing... What worked for me was to have Falcon and I between the dining room table and the wall, and area maybe 3.6' wide. He knew we were "working" because I had gotten the treat bag and said "Are you ready???" which gets him in that mind set of knowing he is going to be learning a new behavior. I had him standing in front of me - I was facing him - and I just gently took a step into his space. Didn't bump into him - just walked into his space. He'd step back or even just lean back - MARK and reward. He learned this very quickly... once they get going on marker training things "click" pretty fast - ime. My reason for training was to be able to ask a too big dog to get his too big head out of the fridge, out of the door, etc... not for performance.
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Dana Martin wrote 03/04/2011 08:25 AM Re: Teaching "Back" [Re: Barbara Schuler ] #320092 - 03/04/2011 08:25 AM
Dana Martin Webboard User Reg: 09-13-2010 Posts: 790 Loc: Bothell, WA Offline	Quote: barbara schuler I've seen Mara's dogs back up a flight of stairs and it is amazing... What worked for me was to have Falcon and I between the dining room table and the wall, and area maybe 3.6' wide. He knew we were "working" because I had gotten the treat bag and said "Are you ready???" which gets him in that mind set of knowing he is going to be learning a new behavior. I had him standing in front of me - I was facing him - and I just gently took a step into his space. Didn't bump into him - just walked into his space. He'd step back or even just lean back - MARK and reward. He learned this very quickly... once they get going on marker training things "click" pretty fast - ime. My reason for training was to be able to ask a too big dog to get his too big head out of the fridge, out of the door, etc... not for performance. Man, I don't think I could even back up a flight of stairs without falling flat on my face So, JD knows the command "back". I taught it to primarily to get him to back up and sit where I wanted him when getting ready to open a door, etc. Any suggestions as to how I now incorporate that into his heel? Would the sandwich idea be a good way to start? Don't have any stairs in my house or that would be a great one. Maybe I'll just platz the 102# Rottie next to where we work Here Decoy, Decoy, Decoy!
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Dana Martin wrote 03/04/2011 08:26 AM Re: Teaching "Back" [Re: Brad Higgs ] #320093 - 03/04/2011 08:26 AM
Dana Martin Webboard User Reg: 09-13-2010 Posts: 790 Loc: Bothell, WA Offline	Quote: Brad Higgs Trying to teach my girl to back up and not having much luck. Is it better to start teaching this from in front of the dog or in the heel position? I've tried sort of both but instead of moving back she sort of sits and folds herself up, if she does take a step back I mark it but she just doesn't seem to be getting it. Any tips would be greatly appreciated! <waving> Hi Brad! Things doing ok in Australia??? Ok, back to the thread at hand.... Here Decoy, Decoy, Decoy!
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Mara Jessup wrote 03/04/2011 08:38 AM Re: Teaching "Back" [Re: Dana Martin ] #320094 - 03/04/2011 08:38 AM
Mara Jessup Webboard User Reg: 12-28-2005 Posts: 2316 Loc: Offline	Quote: dana martin Man, I don't think I could even back up a flight of stairs without falling flat on my face This is precisely why I taught my dog - she can do it, I can't  Quote: So, JD knows the command "back". I taught it to primarily to get him to back up and sit where I wanted him when getting ready to open a door, etc. Any suggestions as to how I now incorporate that into his heel? Would the sandwich idea be a good way to start? If you've got a pretty solid heel in other regards, and understands the concept of "back", have you tried just walking backwards a step or two with him in heel? (with him sandwiched next to a wall) K-9 Knitter
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Jacob Norton wrote 03/04/2011 10:13 AM Re: Teaching "Back" [Re: Mara Jessup ] #320111 - 03/04/2011 10:13 AM
Jacob Norton Webboard User Reg: 02-22-2011 Posts: 17 Loc: Offline	I only use the back command when Im at the door, in the car, or when I'm setting food down. And the way I taught it was at the door I'd say back, give a sweeping hand motion away from me and say back and push her chest with my foot. Not really hard or anything, just enough get her to back up. Eventually she started doing it without me pushing. Marked and rewarded by opening the door.
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Dana Martin wrote 03/04/2011 11:19 AM Re: Teaching "Back" [Re: Mara Jessup ] #320118 - 03/04/2011 11:19 AM
Dana Martin Webboard User Reg: 09-13-2010 Posts: 790 Loc: Bothell, WA Offline	Quote: mara jessup  Quote: dana martin Man, I don't think I could even back up a flight of stairs without falling flat on my face This is precisely why I taught my dog - she can do it, I can't  Quote: So, JD knows the command "back". I taught it to primarily to get him to back up and sit where I wanted him when getting ready to open a door, etc. Any suggestions as to how I now incorporate that into his heel? Would the sandwich idea be a good way to start? If you've got a pretty solid heel in other regards, and understands the concept of "back", have you tried just walking backwards a step or two with him in heel? (with him sandwiched next to a wall) I haven't yet...just started thinking about doing this after reading the thread. We'll give it a try today!. Here Decoy, Decoy, Decoy!
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Brad Higgs wrote 03/04/2011 08:21 PM Re: Teaching "Back" [Re: Dana Martin ] #320211 - 03/04/2011 08:21 PM
Brad Higgs Webboard User Reg: 06-13-2010 Posts: 511 Loc: Western Australia Offline	Hey Dana, all's well where I'm at they've been having a hard time elsewhere, back to topic Trying to teach it for performance as sometimes she'll sneak forward a couple of inches on a sit/stand when heeling and I'd like to be able to back her up instead of having to reset it all everytime. Her heels not great, still trying to build her focus on me but I trained her the "old" way at first before I knew any better so she does heel just lacks focus so she creeps forward. I've got the ME focused heeling DVD so working through that but am thinking getting ahead of myself. Thanks for the tips, it's a bit cooler today so I'm off to practice!
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