I have a 5 month old strong headed German Shepherd male puppy. I can't seem to get his attention with his nylon collar when he is around other people or animals..he just goes wild and does not listen. When is is safe to start using a pinch collar. I have used them only other Dogs and they work great and are such behaved family members but this guy does not want to understand no matter what I do or how many corrections I give him. He just keeps pulling and when he is in a sit he still gets up and jumps and pulls me around. He does great when I start obedience training him alone but when on a leisure walk he does not listen to me around other people or animals.

This link may help you.
http://leerburg.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=239325

 Quote: vicky merry

but this guy does not want to understand no matter what I do or how many corrections I give him.

It is not that your dog does not "want" to understand what you are doing... it is that he doesn't understand what you are expecting of him.

Can you give us an idea as to what it is you are doing to work on training... what is it that you have done to "train" him to provide the type of behavior you want in these situations. What exactly are you correcting him for?


It is not unusual for a 5 month old to be good in the house but then go nuts when outside - if he hasn't been trained, gradually, on how to behave in those instances.

I'm not opposed to the prong collar at all - but if it is being used to simply increase the type of corrections, without adequate training for the behaviors you do want, it can be unfair to the dog.

How much off leash exercise does your pup get?
My pup at that age needed several walks,
& off leash, short sessions in an enclosed area, daily.

I used the prong at aproximatley that age, for the pulling; as the prong is self correcting, meaning, the dog learns not to pull on the prong without any correction from the handler.

Adequate daily exercise, coupled with teaching the dog via marker training, & a prong used minimally for correction after the learning phase.

I didn't correct my dog much at that age, or up until after a year of age; but did focus on the non-forced exercise, marker training, and the prong for pulling, as the pulling corrects itself.

They grow up fast! The prong gave me a means of control for walking, a rapidly growing pup! & lots of Treats!!

Its a hard call.

With a puppy that age you have to remember that they simply don't have the attention span. Some are wild and crazy, some are mild mannered, but develpmentaly they are the same. Baby brains in a big dog body.

As Barbara pointed out, being fair to the dog is really important. You are at a stage that the whole focus should be on building a relationship, a language and trust.

Unfair corrections can be a major setback to this. Correcting the dog for being nutty can be a bandaid for the moment but cause bigger problems down the line.

On the other hand you will have a big dog within the next month or so, and the pinch is good for control if the dog is too strong for you. The problem is that it is very easy to get frustrated and correct the dog when a correction isn't warranted.

Spend as much time as you can working gradualy working on focus and obedience though marker training. Be realstic about what you can expect from the dog for the age that he is. If you think you will still need the prong, its a good time to introduce it by having the dog wear it but not using it yet.

In a PM just a few weeks ago, I was saying that I regret using prong collar corrections too early. If I could do it all over again I would wait untill the dog was around eight months to a year.

Honestly, looking back there was only one behavioral problem that popped up in the first year that wouldn't have been solved with positive reinforcement methods.

The people around me at the time were all about corrections, and that's all I knew. Now that I have more experience I can see where it would have been better to do it differently, and I have a whole bunch of work that still needs to be done with a two year old dog.

Read up on the desensitizing threads, use the search function on the forum. Even if you don't have serious problems, those threads will give you a good idea of how to gradualy increase distractions using marker training.

5-6 months is about the age I started using a prong collar on my GSD. It's not a safety issue--you aren't going to hurt the dog with it, it simply telegraphs corrections more easily. Just make sure you are giving good/consistent corrections with it.

Feel for you Vicky as I have a similar 6 month old GSD.My fellow goes barmy around people but I just hold him firmly in his martingale collar,relaxing the lead pressure as he settles down.He will then sit or lie down on command.Walking,I use the command "close" just to keep him near me,using markers.He is improving rapidly so there is hope.I have a pinch collar but have not even put it on him yet.I worry that I may over correct him.
we are just starting corrections apart from the anti social ones like tearing into one to find the tug!
Micheal Ellis makes a good point in one of his videos to make sure you do some obedience during tug work so that the dog gets used to obeying you when he is all fired up.It can be a bit discouraging and I am afraid today was one of those days.I just keep repeating to myself aloud,he is only 6 months, I am a patient,caring owner grrrrrr,

 Quote: Tracy Collins

5-6 months is about the age I started using a prong collar on my GSD. It's not a safety issue--you aren't going to hurt the dog with it, it simply telegraphs corrections more easily. Just make sure you are giving good/consistent corrections with it.

AND that the dog understands the command in the first place.

All my dogs are outside dogs and have a huge yard to be free in. But are seperated at times. I have been using Leerburgs puppy training video on teaching here and sit..hes doing great. He comes to me and sits right infront of me and waits for his treat. I have two adult shepherds who both have high ball drive whom we play with constantly. We love playing with our dogs. We have a farm and a gigantic chain link fence. Our dogs get lots of excersize and enormous attention. My problem started when we played ball with all three..we throw the ball and they all run to get it..only one gets to bring it back of course. My puppy only thinks of dominating and when we throw the ball he will bite the neck of the female and does not let go, he stand on her shoulders and just wants to rip at her trying to let her know hes in charge. Its so annoying, so when we play with them I keep him on his leash to watch and he goes baserk and I can not get it through to him he is to sit and watch only then we will play. NO matter what we do even walking all together he just wants to bite at her and be dominating. So thats why I am wondering if the pinch collar would help control this young little alligator. Hes crazy for the ball but when all together he just wants to bite at her, I just want him to understand its not allowed to try to pull away and get out of control. I can not seem to make him understand. I've tried trying to get him to calm down in a sit position even when she is just walking around the yard..all he wants to do it bite and tear at her neck. What do I do to help him get past this? All he thinks of is going at her..hes not quite as bad with our male. Maybe thats why he does this around people or other animals. I try to be patient but I have no answers to his behavior with our female dog.

I sounds like he is getting over stimulated when you play.

What is the female doing when he does this? Is she just tolerant of him or does she seem freaked out?

Have either of the dogs ever corrected him for being a pain in the butt?