Duke really likes to zone out and chew on/shred his acceptable toys around the house, so I decided to get him a treat ball and see if it would last longer than his stuffed toys had been.

He spent about 20 minutes on it and worked the disc out of it. I realized that he would probably shred it in no time so I went to him and he froze and looked at me, then fled under the kitchen table - when I approached he gave me a pretty serious growl.

This is the first time this has ever happened.

I took him out from under the table by the collar, asked him in a low voice to drop it and he did not. I pushed the disc out of the side of his mouth, it fell on the floor, he did not try to retrieve it at this point. I crated him.

From all advice that I can find, I should have pulled out anything that he would have found higher value than this new toy and swapped him for it, then put it up.

This morning I did give it back to him and let him finish it safely tucked away in his crate. But I know I need to do damage control and I'm looking for sound advice on how to approach this. I don't want to overreact on this but I also know I could easily mishandle it further.

He's an unaltered 16 month old. Not allowed on furniture, I do have to unfortunately retrieve toys and household objects from him regularly which I think (?) might be at the root of this developing issue? He gets his food either alone on the back porch or in his crate, and is required to wait to enter and exit rooms and his crate, as well as wait for his food.

Maybe he shouldn't be allowed to have treat balls or anything without a drag-line on so that you can safely correct him for not giving it up. Trading is for teaching, don't let it turn into bribing him when he knows you want him to give it up BUT also reward him for giving it up. Give him something really good as a reward, high value. Don't make it a fight but don't let him get away with growling at you either.

Going under the table, is avoiding (it would be a whole different thing if he was standing his ground)...so instead of going to him, call him while holding his drag-line and reward for coming to you rather than confronting him and taking it if that makes sense.

Confronting him will only create more avoidance, you want to make it worthwhile to bring it to you. So hold the drag line, call him to you, ignore any growling (this should be non-confrontational because he is avoiding), just reel him in and show him something awesome like cream cheese. Kick the toy out of reach and keep him focused on you then release him to get it when you want him to, don't let him just repossess it again.

Until you get him to hand it to you, just put him in a down while you pick it up and reward for obeying the down.

I know I'm not the most qualified to help you with this, but we just went through a similar issue with our 16 month old rottie. I'll explain what happened, maybe it's the same type of thing with you. My wife works part time, so when she gets home around noon, she takes him outside and throws the ball for him. Before, she would let him carry the ball in the house, have him drop it, give him some water, put him in the crate then give him some ice cubes(she thought that was a treat for him). One day about a month ago they come back in the house and he refuses to out the ball, runs around the other side of the table and tries to keep it. She grabbed it from him and put him in the crate. When she gave him the ice cubes, one fell out of the crate. She went to grab it and put it back in and Marco charged her with a serious growl. This went on for several days before she told me. Based on some other things going on recently I felt this was him maturing and she was allowing him the opportunity to own these objects. I showed her how I always end the ball session by having him drop it, then I grab it as if we're still playing, then tell him it's time to go inside. He doesn't get to carry the ball in the house. We also eliminated the ice cubes, so there's nothing for him to guard. The dog needs to understand that good things come from you and he has to earn them. He doesn't just get them whenever he chooses.

Forgot to say that I also showed her that I make him sit or down or come to my front or something to get me to throw the ball. She was just throwing it without demanding anything from him.

I'm pretty demanding with him in terms of trading requested behavior for what he wants - no bite toy play, no piece of food or thrown object to chase comes to him without him obeying at LEAST one command, if not several. I feel pretty confident that he does know good things are coming from me. He HAS been pushy about being petted when he's loose in the house recently but that's nothing new. Generally I do not allow him to carry his most high value toys, the bite sleeve, wedge and tug, at all - he gets them during play with me and that's it, otherwise they are put away in a room he does not have access to. The fetch ball I'm a little more lenient with, and if he doesn't out it on command during fetch games, he doesn't get to play. He does get to treat it a bit as a pacifier. He doesn't always want to out it. I am thinking I'll need to put it up when he's not playing with it as well. His shredable stuffed toys he enjoys but never has a problem outing them (or the other random trash/toys he digs up around the house. Like diapers. Ew.)

New baby + teenaged dog hormones + change in routine all likely aren't helping. I am worried about causing an increase in avoidant behavior by mishandling this and I think the drag line may be a good way to deal with it. Now that the really high value treat is gone, I'm going to put something with a lower value in the treat ball before he gets it next (frozen mashed sweet potato) and have the line on him before I let him enjoy chewing it up again.

 Quote: Kristin Muntz

I'm pretty demanding with him in terms of trading requested behavior for what he wants - no bite toy play, no piece of food or thrown object to chase comes to him without him obeying at LEAST one command, if not several. I feel pretty confident that he does know good things are coming from me. He HAS been pushy about being petted when he's loose in the house recently but that's nothing new. Generally I do not allow him to carry his most high value toys, the bite sleeve, wedge and tug, at all - he gets them during play with me and that's it, otherwise they are put away in a room he does not have access to. The fetch ball I'm a little more lenient with, and if he doesn't out it on command during fetch games, he doesn't get to play. He does get to treat it a bit as a pacifier. He doesn't always want to out it. I am thinking I'll need to put it up when he's not playing with it as well. His shredable stuffed toys he enjoys but never has a problem outing them (or the other random trash/toys he digs up around the house. Like diapers. Ew.)

New baby + teenaged dog hormones + change in routine all likely aren't helping. I am worried about causing an increase in avoidant behavior by mishandling this and I think the drag line may be a good way to deal with it. Now that the really high value treat is gone, I'm going to put something with a lower value in the treat ball before he gets it next (frozen mashed sweet potato) and have the line on him before I let him enjoy chewing it up again.

bump

How's it going Kristin?

Nothing to report yet, he's only been getting treats in his crate, first week back to work has been a bit crazy/sleep deprived - should have a good chance to observe this weekend and see how he does.

 Quote: Tresa Hendrix

Maybe he shouldn't be allowed to have treat balls or anything without a drag-line on so that you can safely correct him for not giving it up. Trading is for teaching, don't let it turn into bribing him when he knows you want him to give it up BUT also reward him for giving it up. Give him something really good as a reward, high value. Don't make it a fight but don't let him get away with growling at you either.

Going under the table, is avoiding (it would be a whole different thing if he was standing his ground)...so instead of going to him, call him while holding his drag-line and reward for coming to you rather than confronting him and taking it if that makes sense.

Confronting him will only create more avoidance, you want to make it worthwhile to bring it to you. So hold the drag line, call him to you, ignore any growling (this should be non-confrontational because he is avoiding), just reel him in and show him something awesome like cream cheese. Kick the toy out of reach and keep him focused on you then release him to get it when you want him to, don't let him just repossess it again.

Until you get him to hand it to you, just put him in a down while you pick it up and reward for obeying the down.

I agree with this approach, and would just add that your demeanor should be up beat and fun. Make it fun to trade stuff with you, so it's worth it for him to comply!

Went on a nice walk this morning to start off on the right foot. Gave him his treat ball back at the house, I gave him about 20 min to really get into it, he just relaxed with me in the living room. I got up to get coffee and he gave me the "uh oh she's gonna take it" look. I walked past came back and he started to take his treat elsewhere so I started talking to him brightly and stood nearby, he gave a tiny rumble, I just kept talking until he put the treat down and raised his head to look at me. Can't quite describe his expression as anything other than tense? But not threatening. I kept on talking and gave him a gentle pat on the head then left him alone for the next few minutes, came back and he gave me the same tense look for a moment but after a bit more happy talk he relaxed and gave me a good panting grin, lots of praise for him and I basically ignored the treat ball. He's still hanging out in the room working on it right now. Not nearly as strong the reaction from last time, so I'll do the trade off another morning. Good progress?