I'm training my dogs on duration. When given the command "Bed". I want especially on this object increase slowly more duration.

Question 1: Should I train my dogs to go every time to the same bed, that is: should each dog chose her individual bed or is this of no importance?

Question 2: If I give the command "bed" and expect from them a longer stay than on other items, they have the tendency to change the position. I always thought, I should insist that they hold exactly the same position in a stay. They should go on sit or dowen correctly, not crooked.
But this seems to me a quite crazy in this situation. How could I expect from a dog to remain in such a position for half an hour (we have of course by far not reached this yet). This seems to me very uncomfortable and unnatural.
As in this situation I do not use the command "stay", but "bed", can I give to this the meaning: You can remain there in whatever position you want to. Only rule: You have to remain there until I release?

Bedding is always important. I would suggest that you assign them beds.

I would not worry about them holding position unless they are moving off of the area. You want them to lay there and be relatively relaxed, yes? can't do that unless you can shift your butt a bit!

The dogs are going to move unless you have been only rewarding a perfect hold of the initial position. They will understand as long as you are consistent and continue returning them to the same area. I would repeat the command 'bed' and if you're using marker training, use your bridge (ours is 'good') to indicate that you recognize they are doing the appropriate thing and to build duration. Use an egg timer, maybe, to work methodically on duration, if something like that would be helpful to you. And it would be nice to offer them a distraction like a chew toy on their bed once you get to longer durations

When working on duration always vary the time you expect the dog to hold it's place.

They have a much better body clock then we do and being to consistent with YOUR time will only have the dog start to anticipate when that certain time arrives.

Thanks,Kristin.Glad to hear that you're of the same opinion about remaining on a bed in a comfortable position.

The formal stays must be a different thing. There I do expect them to hold the initial position. If not, I don't reward and if it happens again I go back with the duration. I'm not sure about the eggtimer. A good idea to control oneself, but doesn't it seduce to make them stay always the same amount of time?

Thanks for answering - Christina

Bob is always right, to be honest I wouldn't use the egg timer for the same time every time, I would pick times that would increase in duration (and my internal clock really sucks)

Last time I was in the AKC OB ring was in 07 when Thunder got his CDX.
If I recall the dog doesn't flunk until it's moved a full body length from where it was placed for the long down.

To much in place movement, sniffing, whining, etc can get points lost to the point of failure.

I came back into the building and Thunder had a Terv laying right in front of him with it's tail wagging in his face.

Thunder didn't move an inch other then turn his head to keep from getting slapped in the face by the Tervs happy tail.

IMHO, because there was actual contact I think the judge should have had a ring steward remove the dog but it all turned out.

I think the judge may have even given Thunder a few brownie points for that. That was the third of his three legs to finish his CDX and he took first place.

I proofed his down by running past him, jumping over him, walk towards him and turn away before I got to him, tossing food in front of him, throwing myself on the ground in front of him........gently cause I'm old, etc.

All done randomly as to distance and time spent in the down.

It could be a 30 second down, a 15 min down or anything in between.

Distance could be next to him, 5' in front of him, completely out of sight or anything in between.

Random, random, random! The best single proofing "trick" you can do!

Random applies to time distance and distraction be it basic house behavior OR competition behavior.

Random also applies to reward once the dog understand the behavior otherwise you create a bribed behavior.

Kristin, don't ever believe that anyone is always right.

ALWAYS question anything you don't understand or believe. Let them explain till you do understand......or they start scratching their head.

I'm bald on top because of much head scratching over the yrs.

When I stop learning there's gonna be lots of dirt in my eyes.

Thanks Bob,very important advice! Yes I do vary the time - although without a watch - and also the place where I go to and then always come back to reward the dog. I think this part should be more or less ok.I think I will use know a watch in order to make sure, that I vary the time enough.

Bob, thanks so much for spending all that time for me. Imagine I still have left some hair on my head and the others didn't fall out because of scratching but because of age. But even without scatching I'm always questioning and comparing what I hear or read. This I made while searching in the internet for advices how to train my dogs. Questioning all I read - and there were a lot of nonsense and superficial things I had to cope with - I finally met Leerburg. So it was worth the time I spent.

Your story about Thunder I read with a lot of pleasure. You and he are really admirable!!! I'll never reach this standard.
But at least I am proofing the sit, down and stand-stay in a similar way as you describe, even though far from your skills.

I can run away from and towards them, step and jump over them. This works, but I still need to increae the time. (Randomly
of course! I have hammered this in my head!) I also do a lot of different foolish things when proofing, like making jumping jacks, dancing and singing in front of them, sitting,laying and rolling on the floor. They don't move the position (except turning their heads) until I release them.

But in this context turned up a new question in my hairy head, if I may bother you again. (If bother you too much, simply don't answer, I'll understand.)

I was proofing with one of my Pits the down stay with all the of foolish things I described. Slippie kept the down for quite a while. But when I lay down on the floor near to her, waiting motionles, she looked confused and then she broke the stay, came to me and made herself comfortable on my belly. I know I could and should have reacted promptly,the very moment when she broke the stay, but I was too curious to know what she would do. When I gave her the command "go down" she obeyed.

Nevertheless I wonder what was the reason of her using me as mattress. Was this an attempt to dominate me or a sign for something else? What do you think about this?

More then likely you just stretched the time to long for where she's at in training.

That's definitely important if your laying down buy her was the first time you did it in her training.

Every new bit of proofing you need to go back a bit on time and distance.

The down side to using a time is the dog hearing the bell, buzz, whatever can teach the dog to anticipate the exercise is over....UNLESS you randomly (there's that word again ) ignore the noise of the timer and go earlier or longer in time.

I suspect she'll probably eat your throat if she lays on top of you again JKN HONEST!

More then likely she just saw you as an invite to a happy place.

Don't be shy about asking questions. That's what the folks here at LB are all about!