Fearful aggressive pup issues
#408660 - 01/06/2022 10:32 PM |
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Last summer we adopted a 3rd dog. Martin was 6 months old when we got him. He was rasied at a rescue shelter from 8 weeks old and was neutered at just 12 weeks. I do know that early neutering has health and behavioral consequences so it may be part of the problem. It had already been done to him so there is nothing we can do about it.
We don't know what mix Martin is, he has a border collie head, fox terrier ears, a hound's body and color with spots. He is about 25" at the shoulder and probably 55-60 lbs. Anya is a 3 yr old spayed husky mix and Raven is a 1.75 yr old intact male cattle dog mix.
He was apprehensive about our 2 other dogs at first but after time and a slow introduction they became friends and played nice together. We did move shortly after adopting him (unplanned) but he didn't seem to be overly stressed by it but I am sure it was stressful for them all.
Up until about a month or so ago they have all gotten along but he is getting increasingly more reactive and aggressive towards the others. Some of his behavior is quite strange to say the least but it seems to be fear/hypersensitivity based. It was never anything serious and I thought we could manage it...
Today he has been horrible, he attacked Anya over a peice of cheese that fell on the ground and it was not easy to get him off of her. He injured her ear and face. Had I not gotten him off of her, he would have torn her face up. Not long after that, he lunged at Raven for simply walking into the room paying no attention to him and the same way he went for Anya over the cheese. Had he not been on a leash, it would have been a fight.
He is also reactive to strange humans and has tried to bite them. I am not sure if I should even try any training at this point because it seems to be genetic or he has a mental disorder. The strangest things seem to trigger him and we are thinking about rehoming him.
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Re: Fearful aggressive pup issues
[Re: Tresa Hendrix ]
#408661 - 01/07/2022 11:33 AM |
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Sounds like the early socializing may not have been ideal coming from a rescue group. Do you have a favorite that gets more attention? How much dog training experience do you have? How much experience do you have with multiple dogs? Your intact 1.75 yr old male is at the age where he will be maturing mentally and physically and can be giving off body language that he may want to be top dog. Also a third dog in a pack can change, disrupt the whole dynamics of the pack.
Rehoming isn't a bad idea but make sure who ever gets the dog really understands the dog's issues. Being a single dog home is probably best in my opinion.
I'm not a fan of spay neuter for any reason other then health issues. "good" training takes care of many of the so called "needs to be spayed/neutered" issues that come up with dogs. It can also have negative effects on the health issues of the dog when done before 18-24 months old. Lots of info on the net with that info.
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Re: Fearful aggressive pup issues
[Re: Bob Scott ]
#408662 - 01/08/2022 02:52 PM |
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Thank you Bob for responding,
I don't think the rescue group really has a clue how to deal with reactive dogs or how to properly socialize. Anya goes on the most errands with me, Raven gets the most training since he has the most drive and Martin hangs out more because his dad is supposed to be the one training him but hasn't been consistent so I have threatened him with taking over. He wants to learn how to train a dog and Martin would be the easiest, he's willing to please, not overly soft, attentive and not too drivey. I have a lot of overall dog experience over my lifetime, years working in a kennel, grooming, obedience, agility, some handling in protection, dog shows...etc. Before these three I have owned a Chow/English Setter cross, two Dutch Shepherds and a Pitbull mix. I have juggled multiple rescues before, 3 Dutchies and 2 GSD that hated each other. I never had a problem.
As far as Raven goes, he hasn't been any trouble for me. He is very soft and submissive with me but with the other two dogs he can be an ass due to the ACD but is easily reprimanded verbally. He can be stubborn but once rules are established he tries to not break them. I agree with you, neutering isn't the answer and I suspect Martin being neutered so young may be another part of his problem.
The biggest problem here is with the differences in how dogs should be managed between the two of us. My boyfriend had Irish Wolfhounds growing up and a low drive Husky for a few months. He always let them just be, there was no structured discipline or training. This may work with the lowest drive dogs with no other dogs in the house but these are not Irish Wolfhounds. I am hoping the recents events are a wake up call, we had a good talk today and we'll see.
I think the lack of structure and discipline on his part is a major factor along with Martin's history with the rescue and his not so great temperament. He is a nervous skittish reactive guy probably due to bad genetics. His brother was returned to the shelter for extreme shyness I found out later.
I am hoping if I can get my man up to par on the discipline and structure we can manage this. The cheese that fell happened when he was giving them treats without making them sit apart. Even still this dog will need some training around people to ignore them and I will have to do that unless I can teach him.
Sounds like the early socializing may not have been ideal coming from a rescue group. Do you have a favorite that gets more attention? How much dog training experience do you have? How much experience do you have with multiple dogs? Your intact 1.75 yr old male is at the age where he will be maturing mentally and physically and can be giving off body language that he may want to be top dog. Also a third dog in a pack can change, disrupt the whole dynamics of the pack.
Rehoming isn't a bad idea but make sure who ever gets the dog really understands the dog's issues. Being a single dog home is probably best in my opinion.
I'm not a fan of spay neuter for any reason other then health issues. "good" training takes care of many of the so called "needs to be spayed/neutered" issues that come up with dogs. It can also have negative effects on the health issues of the dog when done before 18-24 months old. Lots of info on the net with that info.
A tired dog is a good dog, a trained dog is a better dog. |
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Re: Fearful aggressive pup issues
[Re: Tresa Hendrix ]
#408663 - 01/08/2022 10:51 PM |
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It all doesn't sound very good to me if the consistency hasn't been good. If you boyfriend wants to learn how to train a dog then a good OB class is almost a must in imho. Working with dog aggression, both dog and human takes some serious knowledge about dog behavior AND aggression. I don't think a "wake up call" is the answer here.
I hate to discourage you with this dog but I think rehoming is your best bet.
Your first comment about the rescue group is probably closer to the norm then most of us would like to see.
old dogs LOVE to learn new tricks |
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Re: Found issues
[Re: Tresa Hendrix ]
#408664 - 01/08/2022 11:00 PM |
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Re: Fearful aggressive pup issues
[Re: Bob Scott ]
#408665 - 01/09/2022 02:00 PM |
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I don't think you're wrong at all Bob. I don't want him doing any training with Martin accept some marker training for obedience and agility in the backyard. Other than that this dog is not for the inexperienced. As far as training with his reactiveness, I am working on that myself to get a better understanding of his temperament and issues until I make a final decision. It's hard because I am attached to Martin but I know I can't base a decision on that alone. I have to ask myself, is this feasible with our lifestyle and do we want to do this for the long haul or would he be better off with a rescue and find an only dog home?
My boyfriend wants an Irish Setter and I think a medium drive puppy from a good breeder would be a good start on learning to train dogs. He could use a lot of education and I agree obedience classes would be ideal.
It all doesn't sound very good to me if the consistency hasn't been good. If you boyfriend wants to learn how to train a dog then a good OB class is almost a must in imho. Working with dog aggression, both dog and human takes some serious knowledge about dog behavior AND aggression. I don't think a "wake up call" is the answer here.
I hate to discourage you with this dog but I think rehoming is your best bet.
Your first comment about the rescue group is probably closer to the norm then most of us would like to see.
A tired dog is a good dog, a trained dog is a better dog. |
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Re: Fearful aggressive pup issues
[Re: Tresa Hendrix ]
#408666 - 01/09/2022 11:03 PM |
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Hopefully things go in the right direction for you
old dogs LOVE to learn new tricks |
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Re: Fearful aggressive pup issues
[Re: Tresa Hendrix ]
#408667 - 01/14/2022 04:40 PM |
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Our final decision is to rehome him. His aggressive behavior requires 100% separation from the other two which makes it impossible for us to give them the attention they all deserve. He is so stressed with the other dogs even ignoring him behind even a door that this is not going to work at all. They also are very uncomfortable with him around this is a no win for anyone. He goes to a rescue group next Saturday in Minot unless we somehow find the perfect home before that.
A tired dog is a good dog, a trained dog is a better dog. |
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Re: Fearful aggressive pup issues
[Re: Tresa Hendrix ]
#408668 - 01/14/2022 05:03 PM |
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"Our final decision is to rehome him. His aggressive behavior requires 100% separation from the other two which makes it impossible for us to give them the attention they all deserve. He is so stressed with the other dogs even ignoring him behind even a door that this is not going to work at all. They also are very uncomfortable with him around this is a no win for anyone. He goes to a rescue group next Saturday in Minot unless we somehow find the perfect home before that."
I'm glad you made this decision. "No win for anyone" sounds exactly accurate.
I do hope he finds a good single-animal home.
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Re: Fearful aggressive pup issues
[Re: Tresa Hendrix ]
#408669 - 01/14/2022 11:05 PM |
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Excellent! Your willingness to do what's right for the dog is admirable.
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