I barely know a guy who has several Giant Schnauzers. They are very intriguing dogs and I am considering owning one. Can you briefly compare and contrast this breed to GSD's? Thanks and happy 4th to everybody! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

hi,
i am no expert, but i got a giant puppy a while ago. while everyone will tell you that each puppy from each breed is different, i think that there are some similarities within the breeds. i am finding that they are very slow to mature, slower than i thought. mine is a bit smarter than i thought he would be, and smarter than any other dog i have had. what are your plans for the dog? i am trying mine in french ring...i have my work cut out for me. mine and the others i have met seem to approach things a bit different. they need a bit more grooming, especially depending on what coat type you get. they do shed, but not as bad as the gsd's i have met. mine doesn't bark as much, but does bark. next time i won't crop the ears, though, too much of a pain in the butt. i think your biggest deciding factor would be what you want to get out of the dog and how soon. other than being patient with progress, mine has been great. where are you looking (if i might ask)?
brandon

Thanks for the feedback Brandon. I want the dog to be a family companion and trained in personal protection.

Russell,

Here is my 2 cents on the breed. They do mature a little slower than the GSD. They shed much less than the GSD. The Giant although maturing slower, they are very smart. They will pick up and maintain things very quickly and will never forget what they are taught.

They requre significant amounts of grooming. This varies according to coat type. They come in 3 coat varieties. The hard coat (German) is the easiest to maintain. It tends to mat (tangle) much less than the other coat types. The "furnishings" (hair on the face and legs) tend to be sparcer and so is easier to care for. Another type is the soft (American) coat. This one tends to be much longer and less wirey. The result is that it tends to tangle easiest. The furnishings are much longer than with the hard coat. This is the type that tends to do the best in the show ring. The medium coat is in between the other two coat types.

There are 2 ways to care for the coat. One is stripping. It is very labor intensive. It involves using a stripping knife to pull the hair out. This will also give the coat a harsher feel to it. It can be done in 2 ways. One is take the dog down at different times to get the coat length right. The other is to "roll" the coat. It involves more consistant work. You work on the coat all the time to keep the short areas short. The other coice is to use clippers. This needs to be done every 5-6 weeks. You can learn to do it yourself or send the dog to a groomer. It tends to "soften" the coat. You can also do a combination of these methods.

If Brandon's Giant doesn't bark much he is very lucky, or in for a BIG SUPRISE. Giants tend to be sharp. Combine that with their extreame dominance and territorality you have a dog that will claim a lot of territory as theirs and react strongly to any "invasion" of their territory. They will go off at the drop of a hat. Since most people don't want to inhibit that tendancy in a protection/sport dog, it tends to be much worse. If a door bell rings, even on T.V., often if the phone rings or anything else that may signify an intrusion to the dog they will go off. It can be a huge pain. In most cases they are much sharper than a GSD.

They need much more socialization than the average GSD. They tend to be more suspicious than a GSD and if they are not taught to accept strangers can be a much bigger liability. If they are taught to accept strangers on command they will treat them as a member of a family. THat doesn't mean that they are not still vigilant. Even people that they know well will be defended against if they attack. People that have been in my house frequently are greeted at the door with a full defense until the dog is called aff and they are let in. They tend to be defensive in nature. Unless trained differently they will allow someone to escape if they will, but will never back down from an attack. They tend to have very good prey drive, but it takes a back seat to the defensive tendancies.

They understand the difference between equipment and the person. This is at an instinctive level. The result is they may be a little harder to train. My male has nailed aggitators 3 times around equipment. He will wait for them to make a mistake and exploit it to get to the person.

Since most of the dogs tend to be black, espicially in the working dogs, people will tend to be more afraid of them than with another color of dog. Because of the physical structure they are very quick and powerful. When they hit they will tend to make a full bite and then drop their front shoulders and pull down and back. I have never worked with one for SchH, but my guess is that you would have to teach them to allow the "drive". It is just not in their nature to allow a target to control them in that manner. They will also tend to pull at an angle to the resistance as well as away from the direction that the person fighting them is trying to go. They love the fight more than the bite. They aren't much in to the "carry". Mine have always had a tendancy to win the sleeve turn and stare at the agitator and spit it out at him as an invitation to go again. The longer and harder you fight them the more they like it and the harder they will come in to work.

Now for the bad news. Every one of them I have delt with has gone after the owner at least 2 times as they mature. They are very serious about it. If allowed to they will take over a family and totaly control it. Even in the toned down show lines this will happen. It can be a huge pain. It does tend to be limited to the person they see as alpha in the family. Everyone else they will treat as a peer. They can also be food and dog aggressive if you don't work on it from the begining. They respond better to obedience than physical confrontation if possible. They see physical confrontation as an invitation to fight and are happy to oblige. I work obedience from day one and maintain it through the dogs life so that they will react without thinking about it. They tend to be easy to read, so you can start giving obedience commands and head off an attack form the dog with it most of the time. If you don't do this you are in for a fight you can not lose, ever. My male is very well trained and will still growl at me over his food and bump me on the lower leg as a challange, he is now 8. There is no doubt in my mind he would bite me over his food. I can take it away from him, but I have to use the obedience commands to move him away from the bowl first, down him and then go pick it up. If you don't think that you have the temperament to dominate a very large dog that is bent on biting you don't get one.

I love this breed, but they can be hard to live with. The fight for dominance can be a life long commitment with them. Although very "loving" with their family, it is like having a very rebellios teenager for 10-15 years. If I had been able to find what I wanted in a Giant, I would have not gotten the BRT. The thing that attracted me to the BRT is that they tend to be just like Giant with out the drawback of the owner aggression. The BRT is even more aggressive with strangers than the Giant, and rquire even more socialization than the Giant and mature even slower.

Richard, I think I could handle the dog but not my wife and certainly not my children. Maybe one day I'll have the space and time to devote to one, but after reading your post now doesn't appear to be the time. I suppose I'll stick with another good GSD. Thanks for the input. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Russell,

I doubt that it will be a problem for your wife and children. Like I said, they challange the alpa person and not the rest of the family. My wife can do anything she wants with or Giant. It is just me thet he will challange. THey are extreamly devoted to their family. THe only thing I would caution about is to put the dog in the crate when you first let in Adults. With children they seem to accept them immeadatly, and with out much question. Our neighbor children came over and played with the Giants the whole time they were growing up. Now that the kids are older, he will challange them at the door but he never did that when they were smaller. So the issue is really you and your wife and it is just teaching your wife how to keep other people safe. The dog will only challange you.

Sorry for being late. Excellent post, Richard!
Unlike most of the people, I have to admit I don't know too much of GSD's. So here you find only my opinion on this breed. About the Giants, my opinion is based on living with some of them for several years.
Giant Schnauzer vs. GSD:
- generally better health hope, no dysplasia, nor ear diseases; rarely had a serious health problem with the Giants.
- consider almost no shedding if reguraly stripped and groomed;
- talking dog; thunder rather than bark;
- teenager until old age; as the teenager may be an excellent proffessional sportsman, the Giant with a constant job or which imagines he's got a job is very easy to deal with;
- while a GSD is generally trying to please you and fit your way, a Giant would try to make you happy HIS way;
- both are good working dogs and well ballanced; while a GSD would be happy with or without a job to do, a Giant would demand you a job, and he would do it steadily; otherwise, he gets impossible to live with;
- Giants are passionate swimmers, while a GSD doesn't necessarily like the water. They are cold and water resistant (rain, snow, whatever).
- no problem at all if you 'read his rights' from the very beginning, and if you keep him busy;
- none is better, it's just you who find one of them being closer to what you like and what you need.

Russell,
The working Giant is a breed that has been fairly new too a lot of americans in reqards too Shutzhund, Police and SAR work.The showy long coat fancy Giants for the show ring require a lot of work in aspects to grooming. I had a Giant for 17 years! I titled her in Sch3,FH,AD,SAR. she took a V1 Rating in 89 in Germany and club seigeren.We went on many SAR missions. Richard was correct in a lot of his discription about the Giant but, I have too disagree in temperment Giants like every breed can be very sharp unless socialized properly, I took mine everywhere from fests in Germany to schools in the USA. I did many demonstrations with her in SAR and Schutzhund. Not once did she challange me yet she would beat the snot out of anyone in the suit or civil.She was always well mannered and a happy dog. It all depends on the training the males are much more dominate than the females but with proper training and socialization everything works out.Use Eds tapes and ask questions on this board there is a great number of experienced people here who can help you! The maintanice on the Giant is simple if you do the German cut and strip(Stripping comb) the coat at least once a year. Grooming means a #1 blade down close it will grow in smooth and look like a dobe when it grows in in 2 days. The chest and the legs should be left about 1 inch long and a wide tooth comb works great. The beard should be trimmed and combed forard and kept long based on the structure of the Giants facial features. I had to clip my dog 2 times in the summer around the end of November I would just let it grow and just keep in combed out she looked like a black sheepduring the winter plus it helps with the cold weather in the north country. The ears where never cropped but her tail was.Pull the hair from inside the eat to help keep it free from moisture and infection.
Giants hate repetion they will get bored easyly you need to make training exciting and vary what you do. They catch on very fast to each exercise but remember that training should be based on age and maturity don't push the issue it will all come around and come together. Remember a soild foundation will make a easier working dog and make you much happier.
Be Safe and enjoy your Giant!
Lewis R. Fronk/Argo
Apontes Bail Recovery Agency
Knox, New York

Richard,
Excellent POST BY THE WAY! EXCELLENT information for a new owner too the breed.
I have 5 children and a wife LOL, My house is like a social center with many kids coming around and Pia always greeted them and kept an eye on the house hold the only thing I remember Pia doing defencely was pin my wife too the wall when we first met she kissed me and pia forced her way between us and pushed her right back, talk about the first date going of with a hitch LOL.
Anyway Richard keep up the great job and enjoy your giant. I have an eye on a breeding and a breeder a friend of mine who has an awsome working giant who I would like to get a a male pup for work from. What I have seen so far it will be a great working line.
Be Safe!
Lewis

Can anyone recommend any kennels that have working Giants?