my new rottie pup has interesting lines in his pedigree. on the sire's pedigree, there's about 75% working dog titles, with the sire being an akc ch. the dam's pedigree has about 70% akc titles w/a few working dog titles. i definatly want to put working dog titles on him, im wondering, will he be able to be shown in akc and do schutshund work?

This is such a vague question. No one here has seen your dog or spent any time at all with him. I am just curious, why do you want to support the very same organization that is dragging our breed, and most other breeds for that matter, into the toilet?? The only thing the AKC will do for you is tell you not to participate in working events with your Rotti. They are opposed to any kind of bite work on humans whatsoever. What do you think happened to the american GSD or the Dobe? These conformation people took all of the dogs and bred the working ability right out of them. I would have your dog evaluated by a local schutzhand club or protection to see if your dog has the ability to perform in these events. I would NOT pursue any AKC conformation shows.

Good luck

rottnvegas:

While I feel your pain be careful of not promoting the same actions that you are so emotional about in your post. It's fine to give your opinion but let others decide for themselves what avenues to pursue.

I apologize, I just get a little hot under the collar when I think about that organization.

Joe,

Nothing that has happened with AKC breeds is solely a funtion of the AKC or even conformation breeders. When the working people took themselves out of the equation they just fostered the problems and ended up being just as responsible for what has happened to the breeds. With the exception of the GSD, there is no breed that sound working stock couldn't be finished for a conformation championship as easily as non-working stock.

That is the way the breeds all started out. In reality if you look at the proper show stance it is a reflection of the stance for the breed on alert. Don't blame AKC for what has happened, or even the conformation breeders, unless you have been entering dogs in conformation. If you haven't you are just as responsible as any conformation breeder!!!!!!

Actually, the Labrador Retriever has been subject to this schism between work and show as well. While there are many nice Labs who fit both the conformation standard AND can hunt, there are many "show" line Labs who have no drive to hunt, and many "field" line Labs who do not conform to the breed standard physically or temperamentally. Fortunately for the Lab, there are many breeders who value both conformation and working ability, and breed for both. But the schism remains, all the same, and when purchasing a Lab, one must be very choosy. This schism can be traced to the separation of conformation and working ability as the AKC has done. A Lab who doesn't fit the breed standard can win field trials, while a Lab that fits the standard but does not hunt can win in the conformation ring. However, I agree with Richard that this does not mean that Lab lovers should not participate in AKC events or registration, but rather, the opposite. Participation by people who care about the breed and want dogs that can both work and conform is essential in maintaining breed integrity.

Richad Cannon wrote: Don't blame AKC for what has happened, or even the conformation breeders, unless you have been entering dogs in conformation. If you haven't you are just as responsible as any conformation breeder!!!!!!

Joe Noble: I don't understand this statement, could you clarify please.

No matter anyones feelings towards the AKC, you still can not deny the definite line in the sand that has been drawn between working dogs and conformation. They like the looks of our breed, but they don't want any punch behind the looks, they want a Rottweiler with the personality of a Basenji. Not only is this not correct, it is the reason american bloodlines are strained so thin. What about all the filthy dog mills in the mid west that pump out thousands of low grade pets and mass mail litter registrations to the AKC often times with the wrong Dam or Sire listed. They don't care, as long as they get that registration fee, they are o.k. with it. That is why I don't support the AKC and I stand by my statement.

Joe, I believe that what Richard meant was that the AKC has come to favor what it sees. The AKC standard has evolved based upon the type of dogs they are used to seeing in conformation competitions. Working dog people don't usually show their dogs in conformation, so the breed is never truly represented the way it should be. If all you have in dog shows are dogs that look exactly the same, that is all the AKC has to chose from. If working dog people were to go out and start entering conformation competitions, it would give them a whole different "breed" of dog to look at.

Sorry for answering the question for you Richard. If I was off in my response I apologize. I'm going to crawl back in my hole now <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Out of all possible topics the Show vs Work always starts the nastiest fights. So far so good. Let's all prove me wrong by showing respect for other points of view.

Hey Rottiedogz, I don't understand you question. Do you want to know if it is against the AKC rules to show a dog with a title, or do you want to know if your dogs confirmation is going to be acceptable in the AKC shows?

Vince, come on, this was turning out to be pretty juicy. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />