For some time I have beem looking atvarious working lines and my favorites tend to be related to Yoschy vd Dollenweise,Zorro van Laager wall,Erik v Herculsblick and various Czech lines.Even some Fero relatives but that is one dog enough people have told me a novice could not handle most of his lineage so I will admire from afar! LOL(excuse the poor spelling!!)I need input from members.Do you see any consistency with the type of dog I like? I like big boned blocky headed dogs with good conformation and not to much angulation in back-black sable is my favorite color so I have to be careful not to be color blind like many horse breeders are.Thanks guys

Carolyn VanOrden wrote: "I like big boned blocky headed dogs with good conformation and not to much angulation in back-black sable is my favorite color so I have to be careful not to be color blind like many horse breeders are."


I notice a lot about what you want the dog to look like, but do you have any idea what kind of temperament and working traits you are looking for?

Have you seen a number of progeny from the dogs mentioned working in the flesh? If you can describe those working traits, that you have seen and liked, you might get some kind of answer to your question.


BTW, Yoschy is a Fero Grandson.


Here is a link where you can look at pedigrees.

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/search

Yes I am afraid I realized that about Yoschy after I posted that! Also I got a name wrong.I meant to say Arek Stoffelblick .I am looking for a companion/buddy twho will be protective of me.I like to go to horse shows by myself as I am single now,and often drive great distances and would prefer to have a dog with me,not just for companionship but to feel a bit safer.I also have 2 Siamese I would like to see live to old age,and 2 daughters,14 and 8,whom I have summers and alternate holidays so the dog has to get along with kids and cats <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Doesn't sound like you are looking for a working dog, but a pet. In which case you need to worry less about pedigree, because that isn't going to help you at all. You need to find a breeder that is going to be able to select the right puppy for you from a breeding that they will know well. I wouldn't suggest a Czech dog for you either, not from the lines I like or know about.

If you were set on that kind of bloodline, Czech, then PM me I know of a few stud dogs here in the US that are producing very nice pets with great looks. Dark sables, big heads, nice conformation. . . . <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I also suggest a female.

well like my horses pet or no pet I want top quality and pedigree says a lot about probable temperament conformation working ailty etc.But you also have to look at the individual-phenotype is just as important as the saying goes:breed dogs not paper".I am interested in breeding down the road and would need someone to title the dog .I am in Austin,TX so if anyone knows of a good trainer let me know.Question though.When you say a dog is protection trained what exactly does that mean and do I really need one to be? I hate to say this but I am worried about the liability of having such a dog-although they are not the same as a guard dog per se,I would like input

Hey VC, how are ya??
Just had to ask you a question re: the recommendation to get a female.
WHY???
I was always told that a GSD female is a tougher dog to raise and train. Perhaps in the end most males are stronger physically? But in my very limited experience( NOTE: VERY LIMITED!!LOL)I found my bitch to be tough as nails and hard as a rock and my male to be a fluffy nothing!
Now, of course, my male is a West German show line, and my female was Czech/ West German cross w/ show and working lines, so they had different bloodlines playing a part in that......
I guess my point is, don't you think that the gender recommendation is stereotypical, and that each dog can have whatever temperment depending on individual genetics??
This has actually been a point I have wrestled with for a long time now. And I am preparing to get a replacement pup now for Bella( who is now serving as a police dog), and the sex issue is one I'm grappling with for lots of reasons, so I appreciate your input on this matter!!!
Thanks!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

JP wrote: "I was always told that a GSD female is a tougher dog to raise and train. I guess my point is, don't you think that the gender recommendation is stereotypical, and that each dog can have whatever temperment depending on individual genetics??"


First, whoever told you that GSD females on average are more difficult to raise and train didn't have the first clue as to what they were talking about. Males are almost always more bull headed, almost always a little more independant, almost always more dominate (and rank), and almost always a little tougher - physically and mentally. Of course there are exceptions, but they are exceptions and not the rule.

(And your comparison isn't a very good one, I'd compare your female to one of her brothers to get a better idea of the differences between male and female temperaments.)


I'd say go ask Ed Frawley how many difficult dogs he has had returned over the years, or how many dogs were too much for their owners. I'll put money on the fact that he will tell you there have been more males that were problems than females.


Second, stereotypical? Gender does play a role in GSD temperament, so no I don't think so. There is a broad spectrum of temperaments in the breed, but I think males are tend to be more difficult to live with and train.

BTW, I'm not a misogynist. This is just my opinion about DOGS!
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Well said Ricardo.

well I forgot to mention that a few years back I had a steffen-haus dog who got nervous every time she got in the car and threw up ejust about every time as well And you could not get her to chase a ball for diddly squat either.I have heard many trainers say exactly what you are saying but was turned off bigtime to showlines between her and seeing dogs at a nu ber of usa sieger shows so I do not know what to do.and btw we have to live with these dogs and work or not no one has any business breeding dogs that will go after their handler imho that is not good temperament-I do not believe that has to come wit the territory when breeding
hard/high defense driven dogs(if I understand those terms well enough)

Carolyn,

Are you then suggesting that the Giant Schnauzer shouldn't exist? All of them I have owned, and most of them I have heard of, have gone after their handler at least once. They are just so dominant that they have to have control, until you work it out. Then they are great. Dogs will go after their handlers for different reasons. Some want control, some engage in displaced aggression. There are also bad reasons for a dog to turn on it's handler, like fear. Some very good dogs have handler aggression issues. Don't get me wrong here, I am tired of handler aggressions issues. Plus I am getting old, fat, slow, and have enough scars. So I have gone away from the Giant to the BRT that has many of the same chacteristics and no handler aggession issues. Though I do miss the challange......

What you keep describing you want is a mid-level dog. Not super high in drive, not overly dominant, and with solid nerves. That is exactly what Van Camp is offering to steer you to. Just because they are not the super hard working dogs dosen't make them bad dogs, just not what many of the rest of us want.