Brad Gargis wrote 09/19/2002 02:38 PM Tracking #55600 - 09/19/2002 02:38 PM
Brad Gargis Webboard User Reg: 02-09-2002 Posts: 659 Loc: Offline	If you were going to take a dog and train him for personal protection to it's best ability would tracking hurt that, compared to one that didn't have any S&R training. Basically like taking a Police Dog and if you didn't have to track at all while you were training would it be more ideal for personal protection. I know police and PP Dogs are different, but I mean if you wanted the maximum result in measuring a dog's ability as a PPD.
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John Haudenshield wrote 09/19/2002 03:21 PM Re: Tracking [Re: Brad Gargis ] #55601 - 09/19/2002 03:21 PM
John Haudenshield Webboard User Reg: 07-12-2001 Posts: 447 Loc: Virginia Offline	Brad, I think that the two are pretty much mutually exclusive. Tracking and protection work have little to do with one another. I'm not saying that everyone who has or wants a PPD should spend time teaching the dog to track, if the person has no interest in it. A PPD dog tracking would be like a patrol dog tracking, a successful track ends with an apprehension/bite/muzzle fight. Tracking/scentwork wouldn't have to be part of a PPD's testing or selection. I can't forsee a situation where a PPD would need to track or search a building like a patrol dog. Except if the owner wanted the dog to search his/her home or other property prior to he or his family entering after an extended vacancy. John Haudenshield The School for Dogs
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Brad Gargis wrote 09/19/2002 03:26 PM Re: Tracking [Re: Brad Gargis ] #55602 - 09/19/2002 03:26 PM
Brad Gargis Webboard User Reg: 02-09-2002 Posts: 659 Loc: Offline	What I mean is, if your not competing in tracking at all, would it help keep track of the lines for a breeder that only wanted to breed PPDogs? Sorry for not clarifing that, I know there separate. But does it cause it to get in the way of judging true PP ability if one was breeding for that?
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Butch Crabtree wrote 09/19/2002 04:36 PM Re: Tracking [Re: Brad Gargis ] #55603 - 09/19/2002 04:36 PM
Butch Crabtree Webboard User Reg: 01-14-2002 Posts: 966 Loc: louisiana/texas Offline	Brad, Not only PPD's not do much tracking but the DOD K-9's do little or none. I have no reason for my dog to track anyone. PPD is just what is says, not PPAD(personel protection attack dog) Training to track will be one of many pitfalls with new pup. A PPD that tracks would IMHO make a more well rounded K-(. However it's not a bad idea to have a PPD also retreive.( bring the bad guy back to you) <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" /> Just my thoughts but what do I know? Little but learning everyday!!!!!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> Butch Crabtree kennel vom Avoyelles
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Brad Gargis wrote 09/19/2002 04:47 PM Re: Tracking [Re: Brad Gargis ] #55604 - 09/19/2002 04:47 PM
Brad Gargis Webboard User Reg: 02-09-2002 Posts: 659 Loc: Offline	I think so. The reason I asked this was if you were breeding a non-police dog breed and you knew you just wanted them to be PPDs, could tracking be a waste of time to the point where you could measure the dogs abilities without it? In protection sports would more dogs do better at the other phases of trial if tracking was left out? Would more make the cut? This way tracking would not inhibit a dog to show their real ability in it's protection talent. And more wouldn't be left behind to carry their genes. OR if tracking was out, would it not make any difference in any sport, the same dogs would make it and the bad ones would not regardless?
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Brad Gargis wrote 09/19/2002 04:50 PM Re: Tracking [Re: Brad Gargis ] #55605 - 09/19/2002 04:50 PM
Brad Gargis Webboard User Reg: 02-09-2002 Posts: 659 Loc: Offline	I mean prohibit, pardon. This no editing option torture is really going to make me look like a dipstick.
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Butch Crabtree wrote 09/19/2002 04:54 PM Re: Tracking [Re: Brad Gargis ] #55606 - 09/19/2002 04:54 PM
Butch Crabtree Webboard User Reg: 01-14-2002 Posts: 966 Loc: louisiana/texas Offline	Brad, you may need someone that works PSD's for that answer. I'm not sure but I think most K-9's that don't make the grade fail in the tracking portion of their traiining. I'm still confussed as to why the concern over tracking in a PPD. Yes if you can train to keep the dog motivated by all means do it. Butch Crabtree kennel vom Avoyelles
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Robert VanCamp wrote 09/19/2002 04:59 PM Re: Tracking [Re: Brad Gargis ] #55607 - 09/19/2002 04:59 PM
Robert VanCamp Webboard User Reg: 11-28-2001 Posts: 3916 Loc: Offline	I train my PPD to actively search for badguys. I think there are possible situations where both searching and tracking may be useful It is also fun to train for them. Dog training is my hobby.
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Brad Gargis wrote 09/19/2002 05:02 PM Re: Tracking [Re: Brad Gargis ] #55608 - 09/19/2002 05:02 PM
Brad Gargis Webboard User Reg: 02-09-2002 Posts: 659 Loc: Offline	Because if one was going to theoretically breed one day, and that was their primary goal for their lines, would worrying with tracking interfere? There's no reason or point tracking is important for someone's PPD. I know that. I'm not that flaky bro, lol. Close though . . . But a breeder (most) has to title their lines to prove worthy. And if you were only claiming your dogs to being bred for PPD work, regardless of what they were used for Sport, S&R work and it was a non police type breed, wouldn't that be ok?
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Deanna Thompson wrote 09/19/2002 05:04 PM Re: Tracking [Re: Brad Gargis ] #55609 - 09/19/2002 05:04 PM
Deanna Thompson Moderator Reg: 10-27-2001 Posts: 2261 Loc: Eastern Maine Offline	Quote: Originally posted by Crabtree: Brad, you may need someone that works PSD's for that answer. I'm not sure but I think most K-9's that don't make the grade fail in the tracking portion of their traiining. I'm still confussed as to why the concern over tracking in a PPD. Yes if you can train to keep the dog motivated by all means do it. There are a LOT of dogs that could never do Personal Protection or Police Protection, that do well with tracking or single purpose work, so I am gonna have to disagree with you Butch. Just look at the dogs in SAR. Most are not worthy of protection, but can find something you need to find. My TD is a Maine Warden. She has a bitch that is her K9 partner. Anna can't do decent protection to save her life, but finding dead people and contraband is her specialty. I lost my keys at training one day. Anna found them for me. It is good to have a dog like that around. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
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