Assuming you get a good working Dobe the only problem is their sensitivity to weather. A GSD is good to go all year round with a dobe you have to get on of those gay doggie coats....

IMHO it's kind of redundant to say "Which breed is best?" A better question is, "Which breed is better for me?" Some people swear by Mals, others GSD. The Dobe lovers seem to love their dogs despite all the *cough* bias they face. Talk to people who have had *BOTH* to see their comparisons. On the whole, you can't go wrong with a good GSD...which is the route I take...but in my heart of hearts, I still want a Dobe.

If you decide to go that way, I'll add to the general comment; you will wake up with hair on your face, you will go to work with hair on your clothes, and you will eat hair in your food.

Where do Mal's fit in the grand scheme of things? Any marked differencce between them and GSD's or Dobie's? Untrained, they seem somewhat spazzy, making them like dobie's in at least one respect that I see, Debbie. The more important thing is what the average, only lightly trained dog is like from each division, and how easily and reliably the average animal can be turned into something resembling "Itor." I figure there are some excellent standouts from each breed, but then again I could buy a poodle and say that. (sorry in advance to the poodle crowd) <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

i HAVE to weigh in on this! i have (and have had) both GSD and Dobies.

i have not trained either breed in sch (to this point). dobies tend to be really sweet, soft and sharp. they train like a light-switch: off/on. they don't shed NEAR like a GSD!! they hate getting wet &/or cold. the temperment i've run across in Dobes is Am-bred, rescue dogs. i've never looked for a GOOD working line Dobe, or had one. i think it'd be awesome (if you lived in FL,AZ, NM, CA).

my GSD have been: hairy!!!, the decently-bred ones stable in temperment, protective of their people/property, had an ability to *think* thru problems and react appropriately--they DO NOT have the *on/off* switch that dobes have, ie, if they think something's *wrong*, they'll react to it whether you think there's a problem or not. this can be good, or really BAD.

one must train both breeds, understand the individual dog, and act accordingly (notice i didn't say "react").

if i lived south, i'd have Dobers i think (or would try), up here my GSD works in rain, snow, *some* heat--nothing but REAL heat (95+F)bothers him. i have one each right now--love 'em both...

so i'm conflicted, need meds..... <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Hayley, that first paragraph cracked me up! Thanks for the chuckle, <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

AL

 Quote:

......Gameness is something you won't find in a GSD or Mal or even a Rottweiler.......

How do you define a game dog (or gameness)?

 Quote:

....Gameness is a willingness to succeed or overcome, no matter what hardship must be endured. A game dog is determined to beat its opponent, no matter what odds are stacked against it, even unto death. The quality of gameness should not be confused with prey drive or aggression, in a nutshell gameness is simply the will to win........

Giant/Riesenschnauzers have gameness that Rottweilers, Dobes and GSD don't have. I'm sorry if that upsets anyone, but I was raised with Terriers. .....

"Upsets" anyone? I don't know who was upset, but I admit to being puzzled. <img src="http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

You said that GSDs have "obsessive focus" (I quote), but terriers don't? Schnauzers have "a gameness that Rottweilers, Dobes and GSD don't have"?

I guess I've lost the gist.