Is it just me, or did anyone else notice that dog seemed to be trained to out when the decoy says "I give up" rather than with an out command from the handler.. she recalled the dog after mr "give me your wallet" said "I give up" and I did not hear an out command by the handler at all. I could just be deaf.

I think it is a nice dog with great OB and they seem to use very possitive methods. On a good note the dogs seem to be having fun.



Edited by Jennifer Marshal (12/12/2007 06:45 AM)
Edit reason: I can't spell at 430 am!

 Quote: jennifer marshal

Is it just me, or did anyone else notice that dog seemed to be trained to out when the decoy says "I give up" rather than with an out command from the handler.. she recalled the dog after mr "give me your wallet" said "I give up" and I did not hear an out command by the handler at all. I could just be deaf.

I know very little about this type of training, but I too noticed that here was no "out" command, in the traditional sense. The "I give up" by the decoy, followed immediately by the "come" command from the handler seemed to do the trick. Seems like a strange way to train a dog, and takes some control away from the handler... perhaps the dog knows "out" already as an alternate command?

~Natalya

The ideas behind the training scream the "B" word to me. But I know how the "B" word is viewed on this forum so I will refrain from spelling it out

 Quote: jennifer marshal

Is it just me, or did anyone else notice that dog seemed to be trained to out when the decoy says "I give up" rather than with an out command from the handler.. she recalled the dog after mr "give me your wallet" said "I give up" and I did not hear an out command by the handler at all. I could just be deaf.

I actually caught that too JenM! Either the dog knows the drill so well by now that he has figured out that the words "I give up" are going to lead to an out OR he is just too immature to have taken the bite and held it until a solid out was given.

I will agree that the dog seems nice in OB but there were a few times there that the dog acted somewhat insecure to me...was that just me? Am I seeing things? lol

I don't understand the reason to put all that control on a 7.5 month old dog.

A mal that lets go is not a mal.

Actually, I see vid's like this all the time - they come from trainers that *can* train obedience but have little or no knowledge of protection work..
< shrug >
Easy to spot the beginners........

I haven't been around protection dogs much, but I know if someone taunts my dogs like that, verbally, with the stick, or any ohther object they would go bananas!

So what happens if the woman gets attacked and has no time to give the bite command? She'd be in deep crap because according to them the dog should ONLY bite on command... lol!

Now, it'd be interesting if someone posted a video of a dog doing some real protection work! Any links?


enrique

I agree with Mike - when I read "7 month old.." I did a double take. I just don't expect a 7-7.5 month old PUPPY to be so controlled. I mean yes focus and intelligence are great, wonderful, hooray... but even if the dog is capable at such a young age I just don't put that much emphasis on absolute perfection. In my dogs 7-8 months is still a huge learning stage. Eh. Maybe I am just too lax with my dogs

Robbin - I don't know about insecure exactly but the dog definitely views the helper as a play buddy. He's having fun at least. The pup did show submissive expression to the helper when he was petted (from what I could see ) and I saw all of that as a good game of tug with a higher ranking pack member - almost as if the pup was unsure of how much to play back and was waiting for this dominant pack member to tell him to knock it off and take the prey item. More hesitant than insecure, to my uneducated eye lol

Will - I'm a beginner but I'd like to think I'm not that bad :laugh: but maybe I really am

I'm just in love with the whole protection dogs should never bite of their own accord idea. I'm sure there are lots of people on both sides of that one but personally if I somehow manage to get my dumb self knocked out I'd prefer my "PPD" not just sit and watch the person drag my limp body away... though if I'm getting myself knocked out maybe I shouldn't have a PPD :laugh:

Ah it's too early for seriousness.

"Will - I'm a beginner but I'd like to think I'm not that bad but maybe I really am"


Really, it's not that bad - the control is good. So from an OB stand point it's fine ( but waaay too young for me ).

However, it is in no way PPD work, and shouldn't be viewed as such.

Ah I am sorry I did not mean "that" bad as in direct comparrison to that video, as in no emphasis on "that." Just I'd like to think I'm not that bad, more generalized. I need more caffein before I try to post anything intelligent hah.