Quote: amber morgan

And Natalya, I am really happy with how it's going so far! I don't feed bunnies exclusively yet, but my goal is to have them as the main base. Prior to this, my dog's "base" food was chicken, but I think rabbit is much more of a natural food base (as are mice) with occassional large game thrown in, and some occassional fowl and eggs, etc.

Oh, I totally agree with that! Sounds like a great diet.

I'm also curious about how the little bun buns are "dispatched", and what their pellet feed is made up of (hope it's not all corn, hope it's not all corn...)?

~Natalya

 Quote: mary roach

so, how are the rabbits butchered? (or euthinized...) sounds morbid I suppose but thats the only thing really keeping me from starting breeding them; dont know if I could make myself.

There are a few ways to do it. Most people dislocate the neck in a quick movement...other kill them with a quick, sharp blow to the back of the head. I actually use a homemade CO2 chamber because I just feel more confident doing it that way. I'm afraid I'd screw it up otherwise.

I held off on the rabbit breeding for a long time because of the fact that I would actually have to off them. It was hypocritical, but that's the way it was. But then I looked into factory farming and what goes on there and I now feel no problems giving up the animals from those places (previously the meat supply for the dogs AND the family) and exchanging them with locally raised, or personally raised animals. The way that I raise them and kill them is MUCH better, IMO and it really changed my thinking about dispatching the bunnies. Either way, something has to die to feed my dogs and at least this way I control all aspects of it. I honestly feel really good about it and have no moral issues about it, and have lost my previously significant reluctance to do it. I look at it as a trade, not an "additional" killing. This is why I would continue to do this, even if down the road it does turn out to have an added cost.

I actually supplement their diets with the occassional gerbil or two, also, offed the same way. For some reason people get a little weirded out by the gerbil idea in a way that they don't about rabbits, but oh well. It's another good source and it's working out well.

so small rodents (if you raise them yourself) are alright?

This is a great thread!

Melissa, thanks for your breakdown of rabbit raisin'.

Amber, your feeding program is awesome. I am very envious. Would it trouble you too much to convince my wife to let me raise some of our own food?

 Quote: Mary Roach

so small rodents (if you raise them yourself) are alright?

So far, so good! Rodents are a major part of most canine's diets so it seems logical that home-raised rodents would be fine.

 Quote: Natalya Zahn

what their pellet feed is made up of (hope it's not all corn, hope it's not all corn...)?

The feed is a work-in-progress for me. I try to stick to a pellet that is timothy-based, with apple twigs and fresh hay supplied. I'm planning on letting them nibble clover once it starts growing again. They get the occassional carrot top, but not too much as it will give them the runs.

Because the does are breeding and lactating there are other concerns that are different from the buck and the babies that won't have to deal with geriatric concerns. So I'm still researching it and doing the best I can. There is a lot of good info on the web and through other breeders, but there is a wide variety of opinions so it's hard to be 100% sure.

 Quote: Michael_Wise

Would it trouble you too much to convince my wife to let me raise some of our own food?

Sure...have her call me! I will say the cleaning and such is more work than just going to the store, but it's worth it...so far, anyway!

I have some insight into the fat requirements for dogs.
I got a bunch of 40 lb pigs that had almost no fat on them.
My next meat source was a very large hog with even less fat on him.
I have some 5-6 month old pups and a few adult dogs who lost weight on the lean meat. I was feeding them a tremendous amount of meat, bone and organ and they just didn't put on any weight, and continued to loose weight. I got beef fat to supplement the lean muscle and they put the weight back amazingly fast and I was able to cut back on the muscle meat.
Depending on the dog you might be able to get by with low fat sources of feed. Puppies, high energy and working dogs would probably not do well.
I am convinced that fat is a very important component of a dog's diet.
Sheep, goats, deer, old-genetics line hogs, chickens and cattle are my prefered sources of food.
I also can get free fat scraps from my wonderful local butcher to feed in addition to the leaner meat.

When I googled feed conversion rates for cattle I found 8 to 1.
There are also several breeds of miniature cattle. http://www.naturalhub.com/grow_meat_breeds_cattle_small.htm

Offing the rabbits is certainly a matter of it depends.... the only legal home option at least in this state is a CO2 box with a regulator. Well done the bunny goes to sleep and just doesn't wake up. Poorly done bunny knows their suffocating and panics.I'm an old farm hand myself and actually break the neck with my hand. This however is NOT legal anymore in most places due to the standards the states have put in place with humane butchering.

CO2 boxes aren't difficult to build or expensive and the basic fuel for it is dry ice. Snake raisers have the best systems for this and their easily googled and sized up.

Please keep in mind the 5lb weight is for a fryer whole. This includes skin, organ meat and blood and such. Dressed weight is a 2.5 lb animal normally.

As far as rabbit droppings keep your dogs out of them. Not only do rabbits carry worms but they are also a natural carrier of coccidia in their droppings that are aged more than 48 hrs.

Someone mentioned feeding clover to rabbits. Again, I'd avoid it. Some clover is actually toxic, some grass however is completely ok. Just not too much or it'll be squishy poo.

You can do some work that will alter your results and quicken your grow rates. One is with the use of a terminal sire called an Altex with californian and new zealand does. You can also use a flemish giant buck to get a better growth rate on kits. At one week old my flemish/cal cross kits were a pound. They made 5lbs at 6 weeks. They are however more bone than pure californian or new zealands.

 Quote: Debbie Bruce

I got beef fat to supplement the lean muscle and they put the weight back amazingly fast and I was able to cut back on the muscle meat.

You just fed them straight beef fat, right? Not fatty cuts of meat? How much did you give your dogs, per day? Do you still continue to do this?

My GSD is really sensitive to fat in his diet. It made his original transition into the raw world pretty rocky at first and he still can't handle too much chicken skin, hamburger and the like. If I do wind up having to add fat then I think I'd rather do it in a meat source rather than just straight fat, but I'm curious as to what your experiences were.

Many thanks, Debbie!

I have worked with rabbit rescue-and have had my own rabbits-and i can say that having multiple rabbits, raised for food is not that much work-or money with some planning.

A good quality rabbit pellet can be expensive, like dog food-you need quality.

BUT, you can easily plant a smallish veggie garden just for them, and grow lots of things they will eat. Veggies, plus Hay is honestly all they need to get nice and plump.

The cost of rabbits is not that much depending on where you get them-i rescued a pair from a farmer selling them for meat at the farmers market for 5 bucks.

(not for eating-i kept them indoors).

BUT-now for the challenging part. Rabbits get very painful arthritis and other muscular/skeletal issues when kept in even roomy cages. They are an animal that is meant to roam and graze, much like a cow. When we put them in small hutches, and the even smaller cages that mass breeders use-it is too hard on them.

Personally-i am feeding my dogs raw because i care about their health, etc. I could not feed them rabbits that were riddled with arthritis, and kept in all that pain.

So, i keep my rabbits(pet) in a large puppy x-pen, and gave them run of the house when the dogs were put up-plus things like ramps and tunnels to give them exercise.

Honestly-it is not practical to do that for animals being raised in large numbers for food. But that really is the only way to properly keep a rabbit-even one for food.

But i have heavily considered keeping rabbits for food-and decided that to keep large numbers of rabbits in humane conditions-it just is not feesible for most people to do. If i had a whole barn to set up with individual rooms, toys, ramps, heating/ac, no small cages-sure, the numbers wouldnt be a problem, but once you put that into a rabbit, it really does become a pet.

Since you want various protein profiles anyway, wouldn't it work well to combine rabbit with fattier meats, rather than adding fat to the too-lean rabbit?