Thanks everyone. Poop today looked normal and firm. They seem to be doing well.

I've been looking around for the vets opinion on raw diet ( I don't want to call them! I'm a chicken I guess ) I'm finding stuff like:

-- While Evanger's and other pet food companies pride themselves on using no artificial ingredients, foods containing all-natural ingredients are not necessarily more nutritious, said George Fahey, a professor of animal nutrition in the College of Agriculture, Consumer and Environmental Sciences at the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign.

"Other ingredients can be quite nutritious," Fahey said. "Some customers prefer all-natural ingredients, but it's probably not any more nutritious."

Fahey said all pet food is inspected by the Association of American Feed Control Officials, which requires all food sold to offer a complete and balanced diet. Feeding a pet food with natural ingredients is simply a matter of choice, he said. --

Also a link - http://vetmed.illinois.edu/petcolumns/index.cfm?function=showarticle&id=559

There's more out there but I can't find it again- I looked through a ton of sites.

I guess I'm just afraid of having science diet thrown in my face again, like the first vet who told me "Corn is great for us so it's great for dogs too!" Then she wouldn't listen to me and ran all around the office looking and asking everyone if they knew where the pamphlet was about dogs and corn-and that was JUST because she was eating innova. I can't imagine what it would have been like if I had said raw. I won't appreciate having to get defensive about it.

Heather, great sig pic...and congrats on the switch to raw...

I breathed a huge sigh of relief when I found a holistic vet whose response, when I told her I was feeding raw, was 'Oh, you're feeding raw! That's great!'

(I am so glad that I made the switch to this vet)

I'd be lying if I said that I didn't worry about the vet asking what I fed. I use to hate going to the vet for anything, afraid they might ask.

Now, after butting heads with my previous vet about it, I got a new vet who just doesn't bring it up. I don't let him. Simple as that. They know that they can talk 'til they are blue in the face, I'm not listening.

I finally realized that I decide how people(vets, friends, people on the internet) treat me. This is not a question. This IS the way you feed dogs. There is nothing to argue.

This is going to sound hokey, but part of it is your attitude. Don't get mad, or go the other way and get shy about it. Go in there with the same confidence that you would if you were feeding the food the vet sold. Know that this is not an option. You've just started feeding this way, so it might take a little while. Hell, it took me like a year and 1/2.

I'm sure it sounds like I am trying to make this sound easier than you feel about it. I'm not. It is that easy once you get your mind right.

How strongly do you feel about your dog having hair? Not an option, right? I put rawfeeding in the same category. Treat this issue the same as you would if your vet told you that you were wrong for not shaving your dog. You think I'm jokin'? I'm serious as dog hair. If there was a "stone faced" smiley, I would post it right now. If this issue truly came up I know that you and your B-friend wouldn't listen to it for a second. You would either leave or let it be known that there is nothing to talk about.

And if all else fails you can come back here and we will talk you down. You'll handle this well. Just go to the appointment for the reason it was scheduled. Simple as that.

I've seen a number of different vets, none of whom were pro-raw, and it's not been an issue...I *think* for the following reason:

I type up a list of my dog's problems, medications, supplements, and diet and give it to the receptionist on my first visit. It's filed and the doctor reads it. I don't engage in a question & answer diet dialogue with the doctor...I don't have to, it's all written down...so I never get put on the defensive.

Boldly stated in black and white seems to make the doctors back off. Seeing all the supplements tells them I'm not being a dumb @$$ about it. Taking the time to print up a list is appreciated by them and shows I am responsible about my animals. It is the only explanation I can come up with as to why I don't get hassled.

ETA: I just saw Michael's post...He's right! It's all about attitude and confidence.

Edited by Sarah Morris (01/29/2009 02:45 PM)
Edit reason: Mr. Wise is very wise, indeed.

 Quote: connie sutherland

 Quote: michael_wise

I hate giving advice when it wasn't asked for in the first place. I don't want to be "that guy".

Really? That's weird. I looooove being that guy.

No you don't.

"That guy" is "that vet" offering nutritional advice when my dog is going in for a cut on his foot. Or "that butcher" telling me that I'm going to kill my dog when I buy a case of chickens.

"I have done my research, including several books and many web sites written by vets" helps too, along with "I am very careful about providing a well-balanced diet."

A few vets are concerned for good reason: Folks who feed hamburger and call it a diet.

(I realize that the "balanced" concern is NOT the usual one. )

 Quote: steve strom

There's a list here on the forum of vets that support raw feeding

Leerburg's Raw Friendly Vet List

 Quote: heather perring

like the first vet who told me "Corn is great for us so it's great for dogs too!" Then she wouldn't listen to me and ran all around the office looking and asking everyone if they knew where the pamphlet was about dogs and corn

Really, this pamphlet exists??!!
If that first vet ever finds her copy, make sure she sends me one too - I'm REEEAAALLLY interested in reading THAT one!!

That "good for us = good for dogs" mentality just blows my mind...
But what do I know. I think I'll go share a big bowl of chocolate covered raisins with Oscar - they're always MY favorite snack, so he'll love 'em too!!

~Natalya

A half an hour on the phone might find you a holistic vet or just one who is a little more open minded. Just ask "what food do you recommend" and "how often do you recommend I vaccinate my dog". Those responses will tell you a lot about the vet. If they recommend Science Diet I wouldn't go to them no matter how open minded they are as selling that food shows they don't really care about nutrition. And then you can ask if they will support a minimal vaccination protocol and a well balanced raw diet. No need for an office visit. Just search online for the phone numbers and call.

Remember the vet only gets a few hours of nutritional training. Don't let them try and convince you that they know more than you. AAFCO sets the MINIMUM standards for dog food. Even crap like Beneful or Pedigree passes AAFCO standards. It will keep your dog alive but they won't thrive and be truly healthy.