Backs and necks are popular because they are ridiculously cheap! They would be a fine first food. I like chicken leg quarters because they are also very cheap (60 cents a pound) and have a bit more meat to them than the bonier backs/necks.

The boneless skinless breast meat you've got would be caviar for the dogs.

I would pretty quickly (the next meal, perhaps?) start offering something with bone in it. Edible bone is an essential part of this diet.

Ground turkey is a good cheap source of muscle meat. And it gets another protein source into the diet beyond chicken. It's going to be a ground mix of mostly dark meat turkey and turkey skin.

Hold off a few days on the turkey---remember, we want to get past the "just chicken" stage before adding anything else new.

The reason for this caution is this: In case a dog has an unfavorable reaction (allergy?) to any new food, it's best that the new thing is isolated--so you'll know. If you get no bad reaction to chicken, then add turkey. No bad reaction, then add something new. If, on the odd chance, you were to add two new things and get a reaction, you'd be left wondering which caused it.

I see no need to change your training treats. Hopefully they are small enough that they aren't a significant part of the diet.

 Quote: Tracy Collins

Backs and necks are popular because they are ridiculously cheap! They would be a fine first food.

They are bony in a soft cartilage-y way, too, for beginner dogs.

Backs (not so much necks) happen to be almost the same calcium-phosphorous ratio as the whole bird, so if they are very meaty, they can stand in for the whole bird. If not, they need a bit of MM added. Either way, they also have bits of organ meat attached (kidneys) for a tiny intro to organ meat.

All in all, backs are a great first raw food. They can be the basis of the ongoing diet's RMBs, too, if you find a supply.

AHAHA AHAAHHA I am sooo flipping excited to feed the dogs tonight!!!! YEAH!!!
I am putting the turkey "stuff" back into the freezer for another time, and I have a relative that has tons of deer, elk & antelope that he is ready to give to me when we are ready for it! YAHOO!!! Also on a happy note, we, as a family, buy a whole cow and I just called up the butcher and he will be super happy to bag up the extras' this fall cuz in his words " you paid for them anyway"!!

I am to costco to buy some chicken and start skinnin'!!! :-) I am really hoping this works out - it seems like such the natural thing to do!!! Frasier seems a little dissapointed that the turkey roll is going back in the freezer - he's been sniffing around the counter all morning! I keep telling him "just wait for dinner tonight!" He He

 Quote: tracy collins

Backs and necks are popular because they are ridiculously cheap!

Indeed - I've yet to find cheaper parts than the necks and backs that get labeled as "bones for soup" in my butchers freezer . However, it's also good to point out that necks and backs are good starters because they're such excellently proportioned RMBs (raw meaty bones) - the ratio between bone/cartilage and connective tissue is just right. They're also generally the perfect amount of "crunchy" without being TOO tough for small dogs with small jaws, or at all damaging for dogs who are serious chewers (some dogs will try to chew through even the toughest bone, like marrow bones, and that can break teeth... chicken RMBs pose very little risk).

One note, if you find a good supplier of backs - and word seems to be getting out amongst butchers that dog people will order cases of these things - you may have to do some fat trimming before you feed them. The backs I get always have HUGE globs of fat from the rear of the bird that can make up 1/4-1/3 of the weight of each one - this is FAR too much fat for an introductory raw diet, and truthfully, probably too much for most dogs to be eating, period. Some with very high metabolisms and loads of exercise may need lots of fat to keep weight on, but I'd say these cases were the exception. I always trim most of the pure fat off the backs I get and have never had any weight problems with my dog.

Best of luck - and congrats on the big step! It'll be second nature before you know it, and your dogs will thank you for the rest of their healthy lives.

~Natalya

Edited by Natalya Zahn (02/16/2009 11:37 AM)
Edit reason: Connie beat me to it, again! :D

 Quote: kris karney

I have a relative that has tons of deer, elk & antelope that he is ready to give to me when we are ready for it! YAHOO!!! Also on a happy note, we, as a family, buy a whole cow and I just called up the butcher and he will be super happy to bag up the extras' this fall cuz in his words " you paid for them anyway"!!

Hot diggity! - you're WAY more prepared for this than you can imagine. What I would give to have connections to wild ungulate meat... and a WHOLE COW every year??!! Your dogs have got it MADE! Ask your butcher if he can pack up the raw, "green" tripe (stomach) from that cow too - it's messy, and most people have to go through special suppliers to buy it for their dogs because butchers won't touch it - but it's especially nutritious for the pups. I'd say taking that step would have you fully indoctrinated into the cult of canine raw feeding.

~Natalya

~Natalya

HOLY CRAP! They ARE carnivores!!! Who would of thunk it!

This is what I bought today - just grabbed stuff that sounded familiar from the boards and was at an awesome price: Leg quarters 6 (large) for $3.28 and a whole frier 3.5# for $2.08. The store didn't have any "just backs & necks" today - only on occassion.

So I bought the frier, and cut out the back and neck and finished cutting it - like you would eat it I would a trad. roasted chicken (so wings,drums, breast etc..). Then for dinner I gave them both a small mix of back, neck and some breast meat. I sort of chickened out though;-) by cutting it all up to bite size pieces.. still had to chew but not naw. Was that ok to cut it up? - It was probably more for my benefit I guess...With that said, THEY LOVED IT!!!! Especially the border collie who is really submissive and particular and I thought would not take to this at all - she DEVOURED IT! Then proceeded to try to steal every piece that my golden spit out to re-examine. Of course once the golden realized there was competition for food he readily ate. :-)

I guess my next question is: What's for breakfast! I used up my neck and back from the frier, but have lots of nice chicken sitting here with dogs sniffing obnoxiously at the counter. Should I just go out and get some more friers and keep cutting out the backs / necks and package up the rest for next week?? At that price it sounds like I should stock up. As far as the rest of it, I skinned it and could chop it all into a small heap and portion out into freezer meals..or should I keep it seperated (by piece)??!?!?!?

I have seen the leerburg pictures of their dogs meals, with the leg quarters just sitting in the bowl... is that how most of you serve your dogs as well? Am I just wasting energy cutting this all up?

I can honestly say though that since we decided (for real) 24 hours ago to do this, I have gone from nervous to elated! Heck, I am almost excited to check out the poo in the morning! How sad is THAT!!! YIKES !

Just feed the rest of the cut-up chicken til it's gone. Chicken's chicken. By cutting up the whole thing, you've already gotten a sense of which peices are meaty, and which are bony. Balance over time.

Large pieces encourage chewing, so if your dogs behave themselves then there's no reason to chop food into smaller pieces. Unless you want to. Incorrigible gulpers like my Corgi get their food chopped because they don't have sense enough to chew anything. She'd attempt to swallow a whole horse if served one. Crazy dog.

As you've already seen, raw food is a "high value" item for dogs--so even dogs that might not have exhibited resource guarding in the past might when challenged over a chicken leg. So, just be a bit extra attentive/assertive for a few days to ensure that everyone behave themselves (no sharing or stealing) until you get the routine down.

 Quote: Tracy Collins

Chicken. Start with chicken.

Buy whatever's cheapest--whole chickens, leg quareters, backs, necks...whatever's at the store.

Bring it home, whack it into pieces and serve.

 Quote: Tracy Collins

Just feed the rest of the cut-up chicken til it's gone. Chicken's chicken. By cutting up the whole thing, you've already gotten a sense of which peices are meaty, and which are bony.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTzLVIc-O5E
I'm not pickin' on you Tracy. You're post took me back to when I was a wee lad and reminded me of this commercial. I'm not sure if I really remember the commercial or my dad endlessly quoting it at restaurants.

I'd feel great about giving backs and necks with a little MM from the rest of the bird for a few days. This gives the bone-processing enzymes time to kick in while the dog works on those soft cartilage-y parts. The bonier bones (the quarters) can be in the freezer for later on.

You will end up eventually giving un-chopped quarters, I can just about guarantee you. Meanwhile, if you feel more comfortable hacking them apart a bit, why not?

Nothing will be wasted. Every bit that you buy will be fed sooner or later, with the possible exception of big hunks of fat that often come on backs. So IMO, you can do it any way you want right now, giving you and the dog some getting-used-to time.

Michael: Ha! I hadn't thought about that funny commercial in a long time. I'll start quoting it to the dogs at mealtime when they compare what's in their bowl to the next dog's. "Parts is parts."

Thanks for the chuckle.