I, like Tracey, try to refrain from speaking when I don't have the experience to make a credible contribution. I am here to learn. It is not my goal to impress anyone here (unless I am proud of my accoplishments as a new trainer).
That being said, new members should be encouraged to participate where it's constructive. Sometimes newbies have more experience in a certain area than others do. New members often have fresh insight on existing issues. Also, sometimes someone coming in from the outside has a clearer perspective, as the older members may be set in their idealogy.
Noone should feel that they have more right to their opinions based on how long they've been around.
As you can see, I clearly feel that debate is healthy. I choose to do so without getting personal.

Like I said before I think all in all the board members do a fine job here.

I have seen many a time when they have gone above and beyound in order to help a dog.

But if you are unhappy with the general tenor of the board the best way you can change that I think is to lead by example. Don't think newbies are being welcomed? Welcome then, solicit their opinions.

Don't like the tone of replies in a thread. Post a few replies with the tone you want. No reason to call anyone out, just lead by example.

I didn't say I think newbies aren't welcome, and the OVERALL tenor of this board is excellent, or I wouldn't enjoy it so much. I am referring to isolated, VERY AGGREGIOUS examples. As i said before, my sentiments are not an indictmet of this forum; they are a plea to certain people to keep it civil. Please do not be offended if you're not one of the offenders.

 Quote: Betty Waldron

... Don't like the tone of replies in a thread? Post .... with the tone you want ..... lead by example.

Nice reminder of a good thing for all of us to try to practice. Good post, Betty.

Ya know Duane,you have only been here, what not even 5 months, a number of us have been here MANY years & have been as a whole very respectful...nuturing even at times to many newbes here. A number of people have come here with an agenda & have been treated accordingly. As Betty said, many of us have spent COUNTLESS hours trying to help some dogs.

The folks here are more concerned about the welfare of the dogs then they are about occasionlly stepping on a few toes if needed. And there are times that it IS needed. Even Ed or Cindy has stepped in on occasion when needed.

I personally think that you are WAY OFF base complaining about how people are being treated here. Maybe you should check out some of the other boards before you make that kind of statement about the good folks here. You will not find the kind of caring & 'tolerance' on other boards that you will find here. Not by a long shot.

I don't think Duane is saying the overall feel here is bad at all. I think she is merely pointing out that in rare instances we can get carried away in regards to the welfare of dogs...even when the owner is reaching out to change their dog's situation, they know they don't know so they ask. I think its just that after seeing redundant common stupidity in the world we jump to conclusions at times.

That said, there are those who want to argue with us after asking advice, that's different.

And yes whomever posted about leading by example, great idea!!!

 Quote: Duane Hull

I didn't say I think newbies aren't welcome, and the OVERALL tenor of this board is excellent, or I wouldn't enjoy it so much. I am referring to isolated, VERY AGGREGIOUS examples. As i said before, my sentiments are not an indictmet of this forum; they are a plea to certain people to keep it civil. Please do not be offended if you're not one of the offenders.

I know you didn't say the overall tone Duane. And I won't speak for anyone else but I know I'm not offended by your post.

My point is that the board has a collective personality of it's members. If you think a post is getting personal where maybe it shouldn't be a post from you getting the thread back on track can change the whole tone of the thread. I've seen it work time after time again.

People's posts reflect their personality. And like any vibrant community we have personalities that cover both ends of the spectrum. Think of it, how boring would a party be if all people attending had the same marital status, the same education, the same political and religious beliefs?

In addition I think generally we are pretty good at policing our own. Not perfect, but pretty good. I know of more then one occasion where pm's were sent suggesting a long time member might want to take a break from a thread for a night......

And I've seen this board really pull together when a member needed help with something.

What I'm most proud of, is that generally when a post does become a bit combative it is because there is real concern about a dog. The frustration is normally because a dog may be in danger due to no fault of his own. And the frustration is only obvious after pages of posts that often scan weeks.

I'm not belittling your concerns or attempting to minimize them. But I really do believe that is you want change in a group you have to be the agent of that change.

I am kind of of puzzled by this -

 Quote:

One of the posts I was frustrated with was Mara's school project thread.

FWIW, I wasn't frustrated by it. There were some helpful ideas, good sugestions and also ones that I didn't quite agree with. But it's like that with most forum threads. I'm glad people added their ideas to give me something to think about. Even the sub-discussion that could be interpertated as slightly heated gave me some food for thought.

I just take away what I feel will work for me

 Quote:

I do notice that not one of those who took exception to my post are ones that I consider to be offenders

This whole idea of who an "offender" is going to often going to be influenced by our own personality as much as anything. The human mind is capable of reading a whole lot into a situation based on our personal experiences and perceptions.

Betty;
Thanks for the clarification of the other parts of your post.

 Quote: Betty Waldron

But I really do believe that is you want change in a group you have to be the agent of that change.

By appealing to the forum as a whole, I thought that was what I was trying to do, and I truly do appreciate the constructive bits of advice from you, Mara, and Tracey. I agree that we all need to be different and we all bring something different to the table. I just think it would be a much more enjoyable experience without some of the intolerance that is sometimes displayed.

I was puzzled by the reference to Mara's thread too. I saw only differences of opinion.


Anyway, personal insults are one thing and disagreements are another,

Personal insults are best avoided, and mods will intervene if notified.

Disagreements -- they are part of the whole idea of a board like this. They're here to stay. If they were not, then the purpose of such a board is lost.