Quote: andrew harris

 Quote: andrew harris

 Quote: Connie Sutherland

 Quote: andrew harris

As far as the comments regarding me having "a mobile dog park" walking all the dogs together bonds them together and creates harmony amongst the pack hence how I am able to have them all sleeping on the same bed together and even eating together without any issues

The thing is, and this is not the first, second, third, or fourth time this has been stressed, you have responsibility to others besides your pack.

Taking a pack you cannot control if something happens into public places is irresponsible. That's my opinion.

You have been asked what your backup plan is, should something happen. There has never been an answer. There really IS no answer, IMHO.

It's a bad ratio of handler-to-dog for public spaces.

If you express exactly what you mean by "if something happens" I may be able to answer .I have already explained that it is the exception rather than the rule to have my dogs off leash.When walking them together on leash I have encountered,what I consider,pretty much every situation that might cause problems,without problems occurring, other dogs offleash amd on growling and lunging at my dogs and they all simply ignore that occurrance and I keep moving ,cyclist,crowds of people,whatever noise you care to mention,cats,squirrels,pigeons I could go on but none of these situations cause a problem,I'm not overpowered by the pack and pulled along as I have already shown in videos;just to refresh :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lT7npxin6WA&feature=share&list=UUKl6g2JcIjvgmhEM1htTQHg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5cgd7cdHXY4&feature=share&list=UUKl6g2JcIjvgmhEM1htTQHg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUtGgRraphc&feature=share&list=UUKl6g2JcIjvgmhEM1htTQHg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvV6NBza6GE&feature=share&list=UUKl6g2JcIjvgmhEM1htTQHg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u7XbbA94-dg&feature=share&list=UUKl6g2JcIjvgmhEM1htTQHg

Note the dogs walk only at my side or behind me at all times.

Here is another video of me training together,changing pace and getting them to all come to a stop,the dound is on and note the corrections that occurr and how quickly the corrections take effect.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YHU5A5Uh-I&feature=share&list=UUKl6g2JcIjvgmhEM1htTQHg



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kUtGgRraphc&feature=share&list=UUKl6g2JcIjvgmhEM1htTQHg

I not only take them out altogether but seperately also.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fndfLkHULtQ&feature=share&list=UUKl6g2JcIjvgmhEM1htTQHg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32bnq-e2CJ0&feature=share&list=UUKl6g2JcIjvgmhEM1htTQHg

I have never encountered a time when I have not been able to keep them under control when they are all leashed and I hold them in one hand which allows me to step in front of them something you will notice I do often in my videos.Additionally whilst accept the feed back regarding them interacting with other dogs it is obvious to see that they are not dog agressive individually or as a pack,I have posted over 30 videos here and when you consider the breed there is never any sign of grabbing or growling at other dogs.I have spent alot of time getting them all to be tolerant and un-nerved of everything I can.
So if you would be more precise of what sort of thing you are trying to say I will perhaps either learn something or explain what I would do or have already done depending on the situation you describe.

Have you read the above post I posted Duane?

You make my point for me...how about a simple, direct answer, rather than an endless diatribe complete with countless links to MORE videos that arouse concerns.

A wise man once told me that, when you find yourself in a hole, quit digging. I'm out.

BIG yawn....<SIGH>

Is this EVER going to END??!!!

 Quote: Duane Hull

.... You make my point for me...how about a simple, direct answer, rather than an endless diatribe complete with countless links to MORE videos that arouse concerns.

A wise man once told me that, when you find yourself in a hole, quit digging. I'm out.

In a nutshell.

hey guys . . . sorry if i prolonged the suffering . looking forward to a reply . tough communicating with someone 9 hours ahead .

i'm trying to offer help where i can see i have something to add , but even i'm coming to the end of my participation .

i hope the " mentor " has a day job , cause i don't see a great deal of improvement either in the behaviour of the dogs or their handling lol .

funny thing is , i'm not even that fond of the breed , but a dog is a dog . don't know why i bothered in the first place . . .

"tough communicating with someone 9 hours ahead "

... who doesn't answer direct questions.

 Quote: ian bunbury

i'm trying to offer help where i can see i have something to add ...... a dog is a dog . don't know why i bothered in the first place . . .

You bothered because you saw that help was needed and you could offer some. Many people tried.

That's all we can do ....

Now that was a read and a half. I know I'm not around much anymore, but I thought I would but in $.02.

Here's a scenario for you Andrew.

You are out walking your 800 lb. dog pack on leash in what you call "absolute control" and a truly aggressive dog on a flexi-leash, complete with clueless owner attached to the aft end, decides to pick a fight with you and your dogs. You put the slobbery mob behind you and face the aggressor with full intent on driving him away, or potentially rehabilitating him on the fly with your pack of neos. He decides you aren't worth the trouble, flanks you, and latches onto one of your neos in a meaningful way. His owner is right behind him trying to stop the mess that is now unfolding, and your pack defends itself. Tell me how your are going to control that situation? How are you going to keep that aggressive dog from being killed, and possibly his irresponsible owner? If you think you are man enough to handle 4 pissed off dogs by yourself, you are sorely mistaken.

Another thing you need to consider. This is a working dog forum... not "working breed", but working dog. This implies a level of control that you are in no way familiar with. I can DOWN my dog at 200 meters when she is chasing a goat / kid / person firing a gun / whatever. She will recall to me from any distance under any distraction. I know this because I have trained and proofed this behavior. Not because I have a warm and fuzzy about my relationship with my dog. Back tying a low drive dog to a fence and walking away from it is not training; it is conditioning. Having the same dog respond to commands under the same distractions would be training.

You see willing compliance of a biddable dog to perform simple tasks, such as sit when it feels like it, as trained behavior. We consider a dog OUTING when it wants to bite, and recalling when it wants to do anything BUT recall as trained behavior.

You are talking about running your Mini Cooper in an F1 forum.

I suggest you read. Get some videos. Open your mind to what you are missing. Listen to people who are trying to help you. If you do that, you will be a much better trainer at the end of the day.

Best of luck. I hope no one gets hurt.


P.S. Hey everybody

Hey, David, great to see your name!

Great post, too.

Hey David glad to see you!

nice post back dave . . .

took you 20 pages to get in , your post might have saved us all some time lol .

looking forward to a response .