Re: General ?'s on White Shepherds--Trainability e
[Re: brock wilson ]
#99384 - 02/28/2006 12:03 PM |
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The UKC (United Kennel Club) recognizes what they call the White Shepherd Dog. There are tons of other less recognizable organizations that promote the white german shepherd. I've seen a number of them over the years and most all of them have been nerve bags. That being said, my buddies daughter had one a number of years ago that was all you could ask for in a good dog. Miracles do happen!
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Re: General ?'s on White Shepherds--Trainability e
[Re: Mike J Schoonbrood ]
#99385 - 02/28/2006 12:30 PM |
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Mike I do not know. I just remember my father "killing" those pups, and believe me it was sad.
I just know they are unwanted or at leas used to be. In Europe/ Slovakia these dogs are called : canadian-american shepherd. Not GSD. It is because, IMO breeders in Slovakia dont recognize this as a GSD. That is all I know. It is separate breed and mostly seen in US or Canada... I was told.
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Re: General ?'s on White Shepherds--Trainability e
[Re: Robert VanCamp ]
#99386 - 02/28/2006 12:40 PM |
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White coat, dark eyes and dark mouth.. The lining is dark, I have never seen albino shepherd honestly, Arent they very white skinned or very pink rather with red nose, light eye? These pupies had dark noses and dark pigmetation/eyes did not see, still blind and little.The one I new that came up from that working litter was beautifull, but workod for search only I think (he had also dark nose and eyes). Never any protection. At least I have not seen him. Neutered.
Hope it helps
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Re: General ?'s on White Shepherds--Trainability e
[Re: Martina C Wilson ]
#99387 - 02/28/2006 03:04 PM |
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Seems the old-time breeders were on to something ... and it wasn't just a color preference.
Research by Temple Grandin has shown that depigmentation (white coats) has a strong negative correlation with the mental traits we seek in working dogs. Essentially, the molecule that drives the creation of melanin (coloring) during fetal development has an important role in the development of the brain and nervous system. There is a strong, cross-species tendency to nervousness as the amount of depigmentation increases.
Scroll down to the section on Depigmentation, Behaviour and Defects
http://www.grandin.com/welfare/genetics.animal.welfare.html
This older thread covers much of the same ground as this one.
http://www.leerburg.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/103170/page/0/fpart/1/vc/1
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Re: General ?'s on White Shepherds--Trainability e
[Re: Charlie Snyder ]
#99388 - 02/28/2006 03:19 PM |
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Eh.. I wouldn't breed a white dog, and maybe not the parents again, but I wouldn't shoot it for being white. I'd either keep it as a pet or see what kinda working ability the dog had, but that's just me, I'm not a fan of killing a puppy just because he's the wrong color, that's like euthanizing all the dogs in shelters because they don't conform to breed standards... I think dogs in shelters are more psychologically screwed up than a white GSD.
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Re: General ?'s on White Shepherds--Trainability e
[Re: brock wilson ]
#99389 - 02/28/2006 06:03 PM |
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I have had several white shepherds over the years. One of which is 11 now, he's the best dog I've ever had. He was my first agility dog. Great drive, he'll do anything for a ball, and he's so much fun. One WGS dog I rescued was a bundle of nerves, more issues than you could count, afraid of everything but people, and he would go home with anyone. He never developed a loyalty or strong bond to me. I got a 2 yr old white female from a customer of mine last year when they had nowhere to turn, and she is the sweetest, most mellow dog I've ever had. I planned on finding a home for her, but she was very sick when I got her and I spent a fortune in vet bills and, well, still have her. I had my first working line pup ordered at the time so the last thing I really wanted was another dog. I do agility with her also, very easy to train, wanting to please. I don't think she has the drive to be superfast for the sport, but she enjoys it, and she is a joy to take, so we'll see how it goes for her. I was in one of the local white shepherd clubs for a while quite a few years ago, but they were mostly into conformation and I didn't feel I fit in. I still check in on a few sites once in a blue moon and I see some are breeding with the sables carrying the white recessive gene, but again it is show line american dogs. Some are concerned with the hereditary genetic problems and have a website to list these. There is only one breeder of white shepherds I know of that has had several SAR dogs and a few police and service dogs. I don't know if they are up to the standards for the serious handlers on this forum, but I would guess not. I've only done agility with mine, my old dog is a great watch dog, but I don't know anything about Sch or training a dog for PP. My working pup is 7 mos. now and he's been incredible, I'm hoping to try more with him.
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Re: General ?'s on White Shepherds--Trainability e
[Re: Sue Kobus ]
#99390 - 03/01/2006 10:31 AM |
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I travel through Penn Station and Grand Central Station in NYC every day for work. I don't know if it's NYPD or NY Transit Authority police officers, but it seems that their dog of choice is the white shepherd. I can't tell you how many of these I have seen over the past several years. I would assume that if these animals were not up to the job, they would not be used. It would be sad indeed to think that in such a high risk area, dogs incapable of doing the work were being relied upon to protect the public.
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Re: General ?'s on White Shepherds--Trainability e
[Re: John Minaldo ]
#99391 - 03/01/2006 11:20 AM |
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The color of the dog has absolutely ZERO to do with its working ability, temperament or character. It all comes down to what the INDIVIDUAL dog has in these areas. Not what color he is.
I have no doubt that there are many white GSD's that are perfectly suited to perform certain types of work. Just as there are undoubtedly many white GSD's that couldn't work their way out of a wet paper bag.
It all boils down to the individual dog.
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Re: General ?'s on White Shepherds--Trainability e
[Re: Scott Zettelmeyer ]
#99392 - 03/01/2006 12:07 PM |
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Scott, I have not been in Slovakia for about 6 years now. I never seen a White shepherd finish ZVV/SVV but it could have changed since. I have seen too many White shephards beeing kicked out of trials.
That is why I set my opinion on what I saw. As I wrote before could change, I just haven't came across white one that excelled in protection. But I also came across GSD that had NO prey drive, zero.
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Re: General ?'s on White Shepherds--Trainability e
[Re: Scott Zettelmeyer ]
#99393 - 03/01/2006 12:18 PM |
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There are two issues being addressed here:
1. Are there White Shepherds out there that can work?
2. Should White Shepherds be sought out to fill service roles?
I'm sure there are a few White Shepherds out there that can perfom in some areas of service. I agree with Scott's comment on evaluating individual dogs for specific purposes.
I wouldn't recommend to anyone to seek out a White Shepherd as a working candidate, they are just to few and far between. White Shepherds are not poor working candidates b/c they are white, they are poor candidates because;
1. They've been excluded from every respectible working line breeding program for the last 80-100 years;
2. The people that breed White Shepherds breed for color first and everyting else second, period. If you're perpetuating a breed based primarily on coat color, you're on the fast track to oblivion.
JMO.
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