His breeding? Or trained by them as a PPD? There's a huge difference there, needless to say.

I'm not aware of Kraftwerk selling trained PPD's - if they are doing so, it will be interesting putting one of them to the test ( which only a small % of PPD's can actually pass ) someday.

After I've encountered a certain number of dogs trained by a PPD trainer/kennel, I'll recommend them if their dogs passed. To be blunt, there's only about six or seven people that train PPD's in the entire U.S. that I'd recommend for someone in serious need of a PPD.

But then only a small % of people actually need a PPD - and since most buyers can't tell the difference between a good or a bad dog, the phonies stay in business. Nobody afterwards wants to admit that they spent $15,000 on a dog worth $2500 at the most. And I've seen that very scenario dozens of times.
Which is sad.

Just my two cents worth.

I think Wayne is officially a breeder and importer of competitive working dogs. I haven't heard of or from him/Kraftwerk saying anything about PPDs per se.

There are mentions of the dog's pronounced protective instincts towards the family/property, etc. But as I was interested in a working line pup, I didn't really ask as many questions about their trained adults for sale. In is my understanding, though, that Wayne is a competition trainer and these are competition dogs, not PPDs.

Good clarity call, Will.

Wayne will find and train and sale PPD dogs for sure

Will Rambeau

Who are the 6 or seven people that can train PPD in the US?

For the record since I have been a member of this site I have checked many times for Adult trained dogs for sale and haven’t seen any and the pup for sale has a date of 03 so on my part I just assumed Leerberg didn’t sale that many any more I would have never mentioned another Kennel on this board or try to disrespect leerberg, I have bought tons of equipment and Ed’s DVD on training and have all the respect for his training. And I have a dog from Kraftwerk that I would be more than happy to go through your test.

Will are you in Augusta?

Would Wallace Payne qualify has a PPD trainer?

No, I'm not in Augusta.

And Rick, I would think that you'd want to know what the testing is for a PPD before you'd volunteer your dog for it. Some dogs freak out so badly for severe pressure ( like that applied from a hard-core PPD testing ) that they never recover. A lot, and I mean *a lot* of dogs won't even pass the temperament portion of a tough PPD test, so I sure as hell wouldn't volunteer a dog without know what was in store for the dog..... at least any dog that I cared for.
I hope that you care more for your dog than that.

I wouldn't qualify Wallace as a PPD trainer as I've never seen him produce one - he is excellent for putting pressure on dogs though, his size and mannerisms make a lot of dogs weak in the blind, but he knows enough to back off and then let the dog win.
I thinks he's one of the better sport trainers in this country though, he's had a lot of success which he justly deserves.

Rick
( sorry, I missed this one < looks embarrassed > )

I don't discuss the who's and what's of PPD vendors much anymore - if I tell somebody that they bought a dog from some low level trainer that doesn't have the slightest idea about training PPD's ( which is usuually the case ), it just ends up a big fight. Nobody will ever admit that they were fleeced by some fly-by-night PPD kennel, although it happens every day.

As I've said before, most owners/buyers have no idea what makes up a good PPD. I have yet to ever, and I mean *ever* to have heard of someone testing a potential dog purchase correctly before they bought it- nobody seems to be willing to go through the effort to prove that their 10k or 15k dog is worth that money.
And if or when you point out their mistake, you end up the badguy, not the unethical scammer that sold them a dog that won't protect them.

I keep a list of trainers/kennels that I've seen and been able to work/test first hand their dogs. The kennels and or trainer that produce dogs that I'd buy are small in number. I occasionally share that info with some people, but not often nowadays - it's just not worth the hassle.

I will speak up if someone is about to make a big mistake or place themselves in danger, but even then you get bitched at - and it's not hard to see forums like this where there was a wealth of knowledge which the complainers and trolls eventually just dryed up.

Will thanks for taking the time to respond, sounds like there is a great deal of thought and knowledge that went into it, And yes maybe my words didn’t come out right or came out to fast about just sending my dog for the test I would have to know a lot about the person and the exam, before sending him any where.

Will I sent you a PM on training

I hit a $15,000 SchH3 dog with a stick n he came off the sleeve. You'd think that a SchH3 dog would know how to take a stick hit too. The dog was sold as a PPD. No doubt in my mind that the dog will bite someone though. Ofcourse... so far he's bitten 2 people that he wasn't supposed to bite

Mike,
You hit on the key of the subject:
Will the dog stay in the fight against a determined attacker?

That is a question that I'd want answered if I was serious about a PPD.

It's funny, but it's the abused wives that often need some of the best dogs. Their attackers are usually out to seriously hurt them and often know about their defenses ( as they've often lived in the very house that the vicitm resides in ). But then you throw in the complication of the often said "well, I don't really want him hurt badly" or the house full of children and you have a nightmare trying to provide the correct dog in that situation.

That's why I'm so serious about my "do you own a gun" interview question. If a client does not or can not own a firearm in a situation that is severe enough that they're looking to buy a PPD, I want to know *why*.

And any professional PPD vendor would ask the same qestion - if they don't, they are clueless about self-defense in general and have no business working in such a serious field.