I'm a little confused because I have always read that calcium carbonate is about useless, as the body does not absorb it well. I have always had calcium citrate recommended as being the best type of calcium supplement, along with vitamin D for absorption/metabolisim of the calcium.

 Quote: eric eschmann

I'm a little confused because I have always read that calcium carbonate is about useless, as the body does not absorb it well. I have always had calcium citrate recommended as being the best type of calcium supplement, along with vitamin D for absorption/metabolisim of the calcium.

http://www.calciuminfo.com/about/supplements.aspx
http://www.healthcastle.com/calciumcarbonate-calciumcitrate.shtml
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/537809
http://healthlink.mcw.edu/article/964794298.html
http://courses.washington.edu/bonephys/opcalcium.html
“When taken with food, there is no difference in absorption of calcium carbonate and calcium citrate. This is shown by calcium isotope methods. The urine calcium, however, does increase more with calcium citrate, which had led some investigators to think that more calcium was absorbed (Heaney, R. P.) . In the only large, randomized, controlled trial comparing calcium carbonate and calcium citrate-maleate the urine calcium was greater in the citrate-malate group. The bone density changes in the spine were slightly better with calcium citrate-malate, but this was not statistically different from the calcium carbonate results (Dawson-Hughes).”

BUT:

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/412220
“We ... found that calcium citrate may be particularly advantageous in those who absorb calcium poorly from calcium carbonate."

So yes, there are arguments on both sides for human calcium supplementation.

But for dogs, who have much stronger (more corrosive) stomach acid than we do, the citrate arguments don’t stand up. I think I remember it as a stomach acid pH of 4 or 5 as opposed to 1 or 2.

Or that’s the way I interpreted what I read about calcium when I was researching the ol’ calcium-phosphorous ratio.

Connie, you impress me every day!!!

Thank you, from the bottom of my heart, for so freely giving all of your knowlege. I have never had to ask a single question about my raw feeding because you and this board share so much.

Thank you, thank you, thank you!

 Quote: JessicaKromer

I have never had to ask a single question about my raw feeding because you and this board share so much.

We do have an extraordinary forum here. I always start here when I have a question about anything dog-related.

And we have many members who share generously. It's great, isn't it?

And for myself, I very much appreciate the kind words. Thank you! Canine nutrition and allergies are the subjects I am most interested in researching, and part of the satisfaction is from helping in some small way when other people are interested in the same thing.

I learn a LOT from this board. It's great when I can give back some teeny part. :>

I rustled up my June '07 Whole Dog Journal (in which they explain how to supplement if you choose a home-cooked diet; they recommend a fresh raw diet, but they also help readers with ways to feed the best of any other diet they choose to feed, including annual lists of the best canned, best kibble, etc.) to double-check, and they say yes, either form is fine.

(As we have mentioned here, they too warn about bone meal used as a calcium source because it contains both calcium *and* phosphorous and therefore has to be figured differently from any other calcium supplement.)

 Quote: Connie Sutherland

. . . I learn a LOT from this board. It's great when I can give back some teeny part. :>

And, as I've said before, I pray you are backing up those hundreds or thousands of bookmarks you must have. I'd hate to think what we'd do for help if you ever lost those in a hard drive crash.

Mike

Got a reply from the company within an hour that's great customer service I'm impressed ..

So I asked them

 Quote: Geoff Empey

I have a active training young female Malinois. I try to pass her chicken parts RMB a couple of times a week on top of the Urban Wolf mix and the RAW that I get from my farm contact. I get 2 types one chicken lamb based with tripe and offal which I find has some ground chicken bones in it, and the other which is mostly 50% fish with tripe etc. I know from friends advice that there is such a thing as hypercalcemia. I'm wondering what is a safe amount of RMB and ground bones that I get from in my RAW source is safe to use your mix with?

Urban wolf replied ..

 Quote: info@urbanwolf

If you are using complete rmb's with a touch of meat your dog should not have a problem with calcium because it's correctly balanced with the phos in the actual bone. You will get hypercalcemia if you overdose pure calcium at the expense of not enough phosphorus.

You can use 25% meat with bone ground in with the regular ground meat. The problem with using bone ground is that it reduces the protein in the diet if you use too much.

Stick to a couple of necks or backs per day, don't over do it. Also offer good large raw bones for recreational chewing to keep her teeth clean, some aggressive chewers can chip teeth so keep an eye on if the large bones dry out too much.

Your malinois will be able to focus better on this diet as opposed to kibble (if you have fed it in the past), we have great results with working dogs.

I think that coincides pretty darn close with your advice Connie.

 Quote: Mike Armstrong

And, as I've said before, I pray you are backing up those hundreds or thousands of bookmarks you must have.

Well, Mike, you were the inspiration for my jump-drive purchase, and yes, that was what I backed up! My bookmarks.

 Quote: geoff empey

Got a reply from the company within an hour that's great customer service I'm impressed ..

So I asked them

 Quote: geoff empey

I have a active training young female Malinois. I try to pass her chicken parts RMB a couple of times a week on top of the Urban Wolf mix and the RAW that I get from my farm contact. I get 2 types one chicken lamb based with tripe and offal which I find has some ground chicken bones in it, and the other which is mostly 50% fish with tripe etc. I know from friends advice that there is such a thing as hypercalcemia. I'm wondering what is a safe amount of RMB and ground bones that I get from in my RAW source is safe to use your mix with?

Urban wolf replied ..

 Quote: info@urbanwolf

If you are using complete rmb's with a touch of meat your dog should not have a problem with calcium because it's correctly balanced with the phos in the actual bone. You will get hypercalcemia if you overdose pure calcium at the expense of not enough phosphorus.

You can use 25% meat with bone ground in with the regular ground meat. The problem with using bone ground is that it reduces the protein in the diet if you use too much.

Stick to a couple of necks or backs per day, don't over do it. Also offer good large raw bones for recreational chewing to keep her teeth clean, some aggressive chewers can chip teeth so keep an eye on if the large bones dry out too much.

Your malinois will be able to focus better on this diet as opposed to kibble (if you have fed it in the past), we have great results with working dogs.

I think that coincides pretty darn close with your advice Connie.

Wow, Geoff! A truly "I get it" answer!

Good for you and good for them!

 Quote: connie sutherland

Wow, Geoff! A truly "I get it" answer!

Good for you and good for them!

Yeah I am really confident now that doing RAW is the best thing (outside of a snappy quick recall ) that I ever could've done for my dog.

Yourself and Yuko Blum gave me the impetus and confidence to do it. Thanks for the inspiration!