Ok, I think that was it, but I also went back (waay back) on one of my ped's and after about 8 generations, some showy names pop up now and then. If you can find a pic of the dog, it's quite a different animal than our modern day showdog. Wienerau and Arminius are both good examples of a huge change over the last 50-odd years. Caleb has one of each in his ped that are related to eachother (don't remember which is a descendant of which) and WOW-what a different animal. Straight back, walks on feet, looks as if it could break into a run if necessary. IMO, throwing a "showline" in back then (the 50's) wasn't such a big thing b/c back then, there were higher standards as far as working ability. The physical decay was not nearly so prevalent. As time has worn on, the bridge between working and showlines has gotten exponentially wider. JMO. Wasn't alive then to know for sure.

I was alive then, kind of , and there wasn't much of a distinction between show and working lines, if any at all. Fell out of touch for a few decades, come back on the GSD scene and the scene has changed, much to my shock. Shock that such a distinction even existed.

Here's a pic of a GSD in Lear's lines, V Xito vom Baruther Land - DR SGR 1969, SCHH2, KKL1 - Born 04. April 1967. This is the type of GSD I remember, and fell in love with....ahhhhhh, gorgeous in all respects.

Here's a photo of Vilo v Arminius. I'm guessing it's 1980's since his sire was born in '81. Vilo was ZVV2 titled. Not bad for a show dog. I went all the way back to the 1930's and the dogs look very different.
Then what would be the purpose of this, a few show dogs scattered as late as the 1980's?

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/454364.html

Enrique, I used to think that having showlines in a pedigree was the end of all things "working dog" and I have been proven wrong by thinking that many times. A LOT of Czech breeders bred strong showlines in for conformation and better pigmentation. Not all, but most of them. Czech is a small country and you do tend to see the same dogs over and over if you look long enough, DDR dogs as the foundation to them.

There have been plenty of showlines over the years to be awarded the coveted ZVV3 title in Czech, so it is possible and before the "Split".

I can only speak for what I have seen out of my puppy from Xant and that he is VERY civil and was biting a hard sleeve at 7-8 months old, tracking is good as well. Mike Rivers and Betty Mathena have both seen him work, now Mike wants a Czech Dog! I should add that he has Norbo on his dam's side. and has super grips through Chuna & Titus.

So why dont you do this, post the pedigree of your puppy, or the links to the sire and dam and we can comment on what we know or don't know. There is NO ONE more knowledgeable about Czech Pedigrees than Hanna-Leena!! She is the Best.

Hey Art and all. Just want to make sure everyone understands, I'm not complaining at all about who or what is in my dog's pedigree, I was just curious as to why breeders do things the way they do. Just trying to understand.
Btw Art, I also have a Xant son but he's not a puppy, he's two years old. ZVV1.

Like I said the sire is Xant and the mother is Eimi Ro sa. She has Condor An sat, Adela Venusina sopka, Asta v Hainecker, Ori z Danaru (sire) and Oni Honajzer (dam).

I would attach the pedigree but I don't know how. Wait here just found this.

Dam for my dog Brutus Eimi Ro Sa:

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/496348.html

For Xant (sire):

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/463151.html

Now I can take some opinions while we're at it . Thanks.

Hopefully Hanna will see this...

I found a Brutus brother, so this should help...

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/516914.html

Don't worry Enrique, we know what you meant. You will find many people that dont like Czech dogs for the sport or know nothing about them other than what they heard. But they are winning and on the podium a lot more lately.

The mating between Xant and Eimi appears to be open with no line-breeding. That is if the GSD Pedigree Database is correct which it never is when it comes to Czech Dogs.........LOL Trust me, I know nothing compared to Annie!

Eimi is line bred on Ingo who was a awesome dog and good producer of hard dogs that followed the line of Ingo/Held/Bero/Titus.

Titus was the real deal from people that knew him when he was alive, a hard dog that produced well with excellent hips. You see that Titus was a DDR Dog from the above strong bloodline.

I never heard of Eimi herself so I cannot really say anything about her, pedigree has showline on the dam's side.

If he is a good dog, he is a good dog! Doesen't matter what the papers say! How about some Pics of him?

I heard Czech dogs are really sporty and don't do well in anything beyond club level Schutzhund. Hey Art, don't you have a Czech dog like that????

LOL!!!!

Oh Man, he is incredibly "Sporty", I think he is actually allergic to jute and Mike Rivers leg the last time I checked! I think Betty is having the same problem with her bitch Weasel who is 3-3 On Grim.

She is just too nice and too sporty to make it in Schutzhund like my dog.......... NOT! I LOVE my Czech Dog, it would be hard to go to another bloodline after you are used to their ways. Of course, I like Pike and Nick Lines for that too.

Art's pup is really, really nice. He is loaded with drive, has a crushing grip for such a young dog. We take it easy with him as he is very advanced for is age but just the same you do not want to push him too fast. There are not many 16 month old dogs that display the kind of drives and workability that this guy does at 9 months. My friend who is an evalulator for the US Forest Service was very impressed with this dog at his age. We only wish there were more of him.
Art is just going to have to learn how to be a better pole, one without wheels when working this dog. I'll post some video of him after tommrow's training session if I remember my video. Hopefully there will be no holes in my body.
"My decoy Mike, when are you coming back, a date would be nice. We have many dogs for you to work".