 Re: Sleeve Work
[Re: John J. Miller ]
#161605 - 11/07/2007 10:23 AM |
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I should probably start a new post, but will ask and see what the mods say.....
My girl is two now and we are just getting into this, so, what would be the best way to "teach" her to bark.
I have tried the "speak" command with food or her favorite tug and all that gets me usually is bitten. She gets so worked up that she will start the teeth chattering and then just jump at me (or whomever) is trying to get her to bark and try to get the tug.
Would back-tying her to work on this help? I do not have anyone to train with that is close, so standing on the "sidelines" and letting her watch other dogs work is really difficult. Unless I back tie her and work the Dutch (who is a wash from a LE program due to fact that he is not civil, he will engage if the equipment comes out). But then again, a good helper is difficult for me.
Until The Tale of the Lioness is told, the Story will Always Glorfy the Hunter |
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Re: Sleeve Work
[Re: Carol Boche ]
#161608 - 11/07/2007 10:48 AM |
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In my opinion, getting a dog to bark in prey is the responsibility of the person working the prey. If you do not have a good helper, I would suggest putting her on a back tie and work her with a tug. You must make prey movements (side to side and quick) with the tug to elicit a bark. You may have an easier time with a rag on a buggy whip. Once she barks, she gets an immediate bite. The message you are sending her is barking gets success. Once she has that down, you change to only moving whenever she barks. The message changes to whenever she barks, she gets movement and the game continues which is the foundation for the bark and hold. This is a very delicate process, which is why I would always tell you to have an experienced helper do it. But, if you can't you can't.
John
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Re: Sleeve Work
[Re: John J. Miller ]
#161612 - 11/07/2007 10:56 AM |
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I've seen young dogs that won't bark for anything. They'll drive a helper crazy trying to get the bark, but at 14 or 15 months old the barking came on its own.
Everything depends on the dog, and the really dumb goofy puppylike insanely driven GSD's seem to not like to bark very easily.
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Re: Sleeve Work
[Re: Mike J Schoonbrood ]
#161613 - 11/07/2007 11:07 AM |
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Since she barks constantly (if no bark collar) in her outdoor large kennel when I am working other dogs, is there a way to use that to my advantage in teaching her to bark?
Until The Tale of the Lioness is told, the Story will Always Glorfy the Hunter |
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Re: Sleeve Work
[Re: Carol Boche ]
#161616 - 11/07/2007 11:30 AM |
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Since she barks constantly (if no bark collar) in her outdoor large kennel when I am working other dogs, is there a way to use that to my advantage in teaching her to bark?
Though I don't do bite work persay, I did teach my dog to bark (and I taught it late) for a bite (of his rag reward for summer searching).
The main problem with the situation above is that you are not there to mark and reward the barking with a bite. If you are on your own have you tried what John suggested? Backtieing the dog and teasing the crap out of her with something she will want to bite as a reward for barking?
I am quite sure if you start with a rag or something it will transfer over to other things as soon as she realizes bark=bite=fun!
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Re: Sleeve Work
[Re: Jennifer Coulter ]
#161618 - 11/07/2007 11:44 AM |
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Today during my lunch hour, I am going home and back-tying her and see if that helps. If I can, I am going to vidoe tape it.
Since I am down a limb  , I will have to deliver one handed.
If she barks this time, at least I will know that I have something to work on when I get cleared. 
Until The Tale of the Lioness is told, the Story will Always Glorfy the Hunter |
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Re: Sleeve Work
[Re: Carol Boche ]
#161680 - 11/07/2007 03:06 PM |
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I make my dogs bark for everything around the house. Bark and I open the door, bark and I give you food, bark and I'll play with you. Some people might say its encouraging annoying habbits -- but my dogs will all shut up if I tell em to shut up, so it doesnt bother me any. Lyka loves to bark, and it made her hold & guard very easy to teach. She was doing it off leash perfectly before 10 months old.
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Re: Sleeve Work
[Re: Carol Boche ]
#161682 - 11/07/2007 03:12 PM |
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Lunch hour did not work, we are building a pond (woo hoo, dock diving at my house) so I had to make some decisions about that......grrrrr
I think if I start with the kennel and work my way out and have her bark for everything like Mike was saying, plus the back tie this just may work.....
Until The Tale of the Lioness is told, the Story will Always Glorfy the Hunter |
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Re: Sleeve Work
[Re: Carol Boche ]
#162141 - 11/10/2007 11:53 AM |
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Re: Sleeve Work
[Re: Sandy Moore ]
#162144 - 11/10/2007 12:57 PM |
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Steve (per Sandy's piccy links) - looks like a very full and calm grip from the pics!!
Our trainer (same trainer as John Miller is talking about) talks about barking in the context of active and reactive. We are training for SchH sport, so "active" is what we are after.
The dogs in training here learn that barking gets them success. They get "one step" closer per bark to the helper and the rag or pillow or sleeve. They can "make" the helper move (like prey) by barking at the helper. In the dogs eyes, they are actively "causing" the movement and hence, the fun of the game. Later, they get a bite when they bark to activate the helper.
Teaching a dog to bark on command IMO, is a more "reactive" type of barking. Handler gives command, dog reacts by barking, dog gets reward. In the active method, the dog barks to "make" the helper do something, which leads to a reward.
Whether one thinks that is a subtle or a freight train type of difference, the results are obvious.
Beth
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