Thanks guys. Michael, yes, Carbon did get OB work done while I my foot was injured...I was able to move around (I had one of those cool "Robo-cop" foot braces! ), I just couldn't be on it for long periods of time (like when on a walk). But I've always kept my training sessions short, so that wasn't a big deal, training wise. The heeling work was a little awkward, though, I'll admit it. I'm surprised Carbon didn't get a sympathy limp in his heeling.

However, I did consider our walks to be part of the distraction phase of some aspects of OB. I always made a strong effort to walk him daily in areas where there are dogs. He was doing wonderfully. I really think that the fact that he had 2 months without exposure really screwed things up.

That and the fact that the location that this all happened in was such that the other dog came around the bend and was just "suddenly" there. Every other time, I've always had plenty of time and distance to give Carbs a correction before he was at the level of insanity.

Also, what I would have liked to have done was to keep these other people and their dog from moving forward to us until I got Carbs under control, but even though I tried, I think they either didn't understand me or hear me properly over the thrashing mess of a dog I had and they just kept moving forward. It was not as controlled of a situation as it could have been. When I work on this with Carbs, the situation will certainly be controlled.

As for the dog taking the burn, it was my understanding that that's why you use the max setting using a powerful e-collar (I have the Dogtra 1700). When you were talking about dogs working through it, were you talking about at a max setting? Good Lord, I hope Carbon isn't THAT hard of a dog!

So, I'm planning on doing this initially with the help of some trainer friends, using (initially) a non DA dog, and I'll have Carbon in the kennel. He'll get the stim at max level until he goes into avoidance. My goal will be that he won't even look at the other dog.

Then, we'll bring in another DA dog and repeat the process. Then, I'm planning on having a different non-DA dog at a good distance on the field with Carbs on a lead (with the DD collar on as back-up and a muzzle) and the goal will ultimately be to get him to walk by the dog, and have the dog walk by him with zero eye-contact. Then a different DA dog at a distance and the same proceedure.

And if all that goes well, great, and he'll be tested often. I'm a very cautious individual. If not, I'll have the DD collar on and can deal with it. It will always be a controlled situation. Ultimately, even if it seems like Carbs is 100%, I won't ever take him anywhere without the e-collar and DD collar on, just so there is never a repeat of what happened on the trail.

So that's my plan. I've got about 2 weeks of conditioning before we start, so I have plenty of time to make sure everything will be handled well, and I'll have some really talented people working with me. I'm cautiously optimistic! If nothing else, I'll have a better understanding of just how hard my dog is at the end of this.

The only thing in the plus column for using the DD collar, that I can see, is that it's quicker and it's more sure. And those are significant pluses. But, I'm thinking that the e-collar might be better for the details of it all. In other words, when using the e-collar, you stim him for even looking at the other dog. It would be hard to hang him, with good timing, everytime he looks at a dog. A stim is a lighting quick response. Also, when I'm ultimatley able to bring him to a public place, hanging the dog in my town would get Carbon taken away from me...no joke. And according to what I've heard, you can later dial down the stim. It's hard to dial down a DD collar correction.

So what say you? Does this sound like a good plan? If anyone sees any problems with it, I'd love to hear it before we get going. While I'll be working with people who have done this work before (one is the behaviorist that I refer clients to that have seriously handler-aggressive dogs, which is outside the scope of my services. I've seen him in action before and he's impressive), I personally haven't done this before, and the more I can hear from experienced people the better.

Thanks again, all!

Edited by Amber Morgan (11/21/2007 09:13 AM)
Edit reason: type-o

I was talking about at a max setting and with a good collar also. The collar being used at this point in time was a DTS systems collar.

I agree w/your plan. I see why the e-collar is important in your case. I have a different situation, but I think both is the way to go. The DD collar won't fail on the off-chance that the e-collar hypes him up or pisses him off. However, you can't hang him for looking, but you can lightly zap him. So, good luck.

This is true. I hope this works out for you. Keep us posted on what happens with your dog please.